Pivot - couple of very interesting studies

[BerntR]

From OB Left;

Homer said "A Shoulder Turn Takeaway is always under plane".

.....

The Shoulder Turn Takeaway Homer refers to is one where the Shoulders and Arms are locked together and travel as a single unit. United by tension at the Arm to Shoulder connection or via Pressure Point blackout, ignorance.

I'm bringing this back to life as I had an interesting experience today.

Out on the course. Struggling because I am still mixing patterns. I eventually found a swing that had power. And kept it for the remaining holes. Last two holes were driver - sand wedge on a 420 yard par 4 - and then 3 wood + 5 wood on a 480 yard par 5. Both holes were in benign wind conditions, but this was good ball striking by my standard. And the 5 wood was climbing towards the moon before it dropped dead on the green. With a Pinnacle ball. In down wind. What a shot

I was using something that must have been very close to turned sholder plane. More hip tilt than I usually do. Facing straight at the ball. ( I usualy face above the ball)

And adjusting my stance to pretty normal square address position.

The power center of the swing was higher up in my pivot than usual. It felt like ii turned the club around a point almost as high as the shoulders. Whereas normally, the power center is around the belly button and I stand erect to the ball.

Back home I was able to reproduce this stroke pattern and the one that is my regular patter. (Amazing how much easier it is to do these things away from the course.)

I noted another significant difference: The pattern I use today has both arms straigth a little past impact. The pattern I usually use have both arms straight when the arms are horizontal into the follow through. Quite a lot more pivot and hands speed through the ball. Not more swing speed but a lot more thrust. And a greater sense of stability and connectedness through impact.

I have to address the ball wit an open stance to do my normal pattern. And I have to start the back swing from the feet to get the club on plane. This must be because I start from an address position where my pivot is extensively rotated. It is geometrically open (seen from above) but physically it is still closed.

Reflection upon the differences, it seems to basically be a timing difference. In the stock TGM swing, you start with a forarm pickup, and by hip height or so, the pivot and arms move in unison. That's a place where everyting is very well connected. And that's the place where i address my ball, so to speak. I've just turned everything through to a point where everything is connected. And I have moved the ball much closer to the release.

There's just no running out of anything until way past the ball. Running out of right arm is a no isse, since it basically is turning together with the pivot. Today I was aiming my pp#1 and #3 out towards the ball. The stock TGM way of doing it. Usually I aim them straight through the ball on the target line.

It is perhaps needless to say, but I'll say it anyway. What goes up tends to come down again. If you start with arms only in the back swing it will basically be arms at impact. But if you start with an address position that requires engagement from the feet, and with pivot and arms together, so will your motion be through impact.

[innercityteacher]

I lean to the ball a bit more. I fix my wedges at sternum center and feel very connected and powerful. I hit a very long, consistent draw. Using that I have shot as low as 5 over on a 9 hole par 36.

I'm not sure why I stopped. Oh yeah, there is just too many good ideas on this website to try! It is a little like a Minneeesoda smorgasboard when you know you'll be snowed-in for three days

I'm sort of infatuated, lately, with the idea of whipping my left hand vertical hinge down, out, forward, up and in.

Thanks for giving me something else to puzzle over, Bernt, I'll keep you posted.

Patrick

From OB Left;


I'm bringing this back to life as I had an interesting experience today.

Out on the course. Struggling because I am still mixing patterns. I eventually found a swing that had power. And kept it for the remaining holes. Last two holes were driver - sand wedge on a 420 yard par 4 - and then 3 wood + 5 wood on a 480 yard par 5. Both holes were in benign wind conditions, but this was good ball striking by my standard. And the 5 wood was climbing towards the moon before it dropped dead on the green. With a Pinnacle ball. In down wind. What a shot

I was using something that must have been very close to turned sholder plane. More hip tilt than I usually do. Facing straight at the ball. ( I usualy face above the ball)

And adjusting my stance to pretty normal square address position.

The power center of the swing was higher up in my pivot than usual. It felt like ii turned the club around a point almost as high as the shoulders. Whereas normally, the power center is around the belly button and I stand erect to the ball.

Back home I was able to reproduce this stroke pattern and the one that is my regular patter. (Amazing how much easier it is to do these things away from the course.)

I noted another significant difference: The pattern I use today has both arms straigth a little past impact. The pattern I usually use have both arms straight when the arms are horizontal into the follow through. Quite a lot more pivot and hands speed through the ball. Not more swing speed but a lot more thrust. And a greater sense of stability and connectedness through impact.

I have to address the ball wit an open stance to do my normal pattern. And I have to start the back swing from the feet to get the club on plane. This must be because I start from an address position where my pivot is extensively rotated. It is geometrically open (seen from above) but physically it is still closed.

Reflection upon the differences, it seems to basically be a timing difference. In the stock TGM swing, you start with a forarm pickup, and by hip height or so, the pivot and arms move in unison. That's a place where everyting is very well connected. And that's the place where i address my ball, so to speak. I've just turned everything through to a point where everything is connected. And I have moved the ball much closer to the release.

There's just no running out of anything until way past the ball. Running out of right arm is a no isse, since it basically is turning together with the pivot. Today I was aiming my pp#1 and #3 out towards the ball. The stock TGM way of doing it. Usually I aim them straight through the ball on the target line.

It is perhaps needless to say, but I'll say it anyway. What goes up tends to come down again. If you start with arms only in the back swing it will basically be arms at impact. But if you start with an address position that requires engagement from the feet, and with pivot and arms together, so will your motion be through impact.

[BerntR]

Good players tend to find something that works for them and stick to it.

I guess most of us who frequent this forum is too interested in the golf stroke for our own good. At least as far as scoring is concerned. We just have to try something different just in case it's better.

It makes the game more interesting though

[innercityteacher]

Hi Bernt. I gave my sternum aligned flying wedges a try tonight. Very simple and powerful. Mid-body, level hands turning to an angle hinge and back. Mindless. Dependable. Horizontal hinge with a little closed club-face.

I am a real sicko, Bernt! I might use that swing when I'm 89 and I want to hustle a 50 year old!

And then, I started non-automatically beating the hell out of the ball with my vertical hinge. I started a new thread. Come by sometime, I'll buy you a beer or two.




Patrick

Good players tend to find something that works for them and stick to it.

I guess most of us who frequent this forum is too interested in the golf stroke for our own good. At least as far as scoring is concerned. We just have to try something different just in case it's better.

It makes the game more interesting though