Jimmy Ballards Book/Teachings

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  #1  
Old 08-12-2005, 03:08 PM
kebeal kebeal is offline
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Jimmy Ballards Book/Teachings
Does anyone have any experience with his book or teachings, just looking for a TGM spin on his left arm connection and fire the right side theory.
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  #2  
Old 08-19-2005, 01:53 PM
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redan redan is offline
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Check the archives at Brian Manzella's site. Brian has a lot to say about Jimmy Ballard.
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Old 10-30-2005, 11:23 PM
Texsport Texsport is offline
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Jimmy Ballard
Being new to this site, I did a search for Jimmy Ballard and found a suggestion to go to Doug Manzella's site. I couldn't get to his site after doing an internet search--may not be active now.

Anyhow, I'm giving an opinion concerning the original question about Ballard's swing theories.

I believe Ballard's teachings and method to be absolutely correct and his theory of connection, is the basis for the modern swing taught by most teachers today.

Though it may be best suited to "hitters" rather than "swingers", it, nonetheless, is a very effective method for playing golf. It offers greater accuracy, greater distance control, and effortless power---at least for me. It is a rather simple method to use once you've grooved the swing. In addition, the reasons for poor shots are more easily diagnosed and corrected by the user.

Any other Ballard swing users here?

Texsport
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Old 10-31-2005, 05:39 AM
hue hue is offline
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Originally Posted by Texsport
Being new to this site, I did a search for Jimmy Ballard and found a suggestion to go to Doug Manzella's site. I couldn't get to his site after doing an internet search--may not be active now.

Anyhow, I'm giving an opinion concerning the original question about Ballard's swing theories.

I believe Ballard's teachings and method to be absolutely correct and his theory of connection, is the basis for the modern swing taught by most teachers today.

Though it may be best suited to "hitters" rather than "swingers", it, nonetheless, is a very effective method for playing golf. It offers greater accuracy, greater distance control, and effortless power---at least for me. It is a rather simple method to use once you've grooved the swing. In addition, the reasons for poor shots are more easily diagnosed and corrected by the user.

Any other Ballard swing users here?

Texsport
Brian's website

http://www.manzellagolfforum.com/forum/

This is a copy and paste job of a post on Brian's website made by Jim 0068

This is a copy/paste from a post on bombsquadgolf.com by a user there who apparently has professional experience. Not sure how much or where (hides his identity) but he used to play professionally and frequented Jimmy Ballard. Here are his notes on his swing split into 3 categories, what do you think?

Copy/Paste below from user Tiberon:

"First, understand one thing....I am not posting this to debate the golf swing, so if you don't like what Jimmy Ballard teaches, then don't read it and go listen to someone else, because I could care less...not many teachers have students that have won all 4 majors and not all coming from the same person (ie...Tiger) biggrin.gif !!!

I took years and years of notes and broke them down into 3 categories....SET-UP, BACKSWING, OR DOWNSWING. The one thing about Jimmy, is his teaching method never changes, and it hasn't for 50 years biggrin.gif . He's not a "try this or try that teacher", and the longer you are around him, the more he sounds like a broken record, but that is a good thing...trust me!!! Alot of people don't realize, but when you see Gary Player play, and he walks through his shots, he got that as a drill from Jimmy 3 weeks before he won the 1978 Masters and he's been doing it ever since...it stops him from hanging back, which is something he fought for a longtime!

SET-UP

-Feet with the driver should be atleast shoulder width apart.
-The right foot is square; the left foot is flared out a quarter of a turn.
-A straight back at address promotes a level, less around swing. Drill: put the club behind the ball, then look at your caddy in front of you while taking your stance....then lower the eyes to ball (gets rid of the hunched look)!
-In the grip, both hands oppose each other in a neutral position.
-The ball is positioned off the left heel for full shots.
-The chin should be up, and the chest high.
-The shoulders should be level at address and my upper left arm plugged into my chest (feel like you have a short left arm at address).
-The left arm points down at a address...not at the target.
-Soft arms at address.
-The right arm should be above my left at address, not tucked under.
-Both kees are braced in at address.
-At address, the arms for a triangle with the butt end pointed at the middle of the chest bone.

BACKSWING

-On the backswing there is a loading of the weight into the inside of right foot and leg.
-The left arm should be bent and feel short the entire swing.
-The thumbs both feel like they are under the shaft at the top of the swing.
-The club works straight back (not around) with no forearm rotation...the triangle formed by the arms remains intact with the butt end still pointing at the chest bone. No angles or cocking of the wrist and feel toe down.
-The left hip, left shoulder, and head should all get behind an imaginary line drawn up from the ball.
-The right shoulder works up, not around.
-The right wrist is flatter, not cupped (as opposed to some who say you should feel like a waiter holding a tray at the top of the backsing yucky.gif ).
-The left heel comes up, and the left knee points behind the ball.
-Keep the same amount of flex in my right knee from address to the top of the backswing.

DOWNSWING

-The hips and shoulders work through impact with the eyes releasing to the target (ala. Annika....who in Jimmy's opinion has the most sound swing in golf!)
-If the head stays down and still through impact, there will be a hang back in your finish...REVERSE C!
-The only cocking in the swing "feels" like it is done by the elbows, not the wrists.
-Both elbows "feel" like they point down to the ground on the backswing, downswing, and when you finish.
--The left thumb and elbow work like you're "thumbing a ride" through impact. Don't get separation between the arms, because this leads to a blocked position.
-The elbows should finsih close together with a full body release.
-The finish mirrors the backswing.
-In the finish, the shoulders, eyes, and hips are all level.

IMHFO, there is no other method that holds up better under pressure. There is a longtime saying on Tour that is often repeated by some of the best players in the world...."if you need someone to hit the ball exactly 162 yds., then you hand the club to Hal Sutton notworthy.gif ".

I've had the pleasure of spending time with some of the best modern day instructors...ie Leadbetter and Harmon. Leadbetter has ended more careers than he has helped, and Harmon is the most appealing looking swing instructor, but nobodies method holds up better and is easier to follow than Jimmy Ballards. I remember having a discussion with Paul Azinger 14 years or so ago about modern day teachers, and he said that the thing he like about Ballard was that he actually turned golfers into successful Tour players (started working with Hal at age 17), not like some of these other teachers that turned already Tour players into better swingers....alot of people don't realize that Faldo was already #1 in the world when he started changing his swing with Leadbetter. That's every teachers wet dream come true!!!


I don't like the connection thing . IMO this is Pivot controlled hands which I don't agree with. He also teaches a steep shoulder turn on the backstroke with a high right shoulder at the top. IMO you have a better chance directing the trail shoulder downplane from a flatter shoulder turn.
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Old 10-31-2005, 08:37 AM
Texsport Texsport is offline
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Jimmy Ballard
Thanks!

A pivot or turn is "the worst image in golf" according to Ballard. He teaches that the swing is not a turn or pivot--just back and through.

Texsport
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Old 10-31-2005, 10:00 AM
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6bmike 6bmike is offline
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Originally Posted by Texsport
Thanks!

A pivot or turn is "the worst image in golf" according to Ballard. He teaches that the swing is not a turn or pivot--just back and through.

Texsport
And there in lies Ballards problem - teaching a sway. Ballard has a tough time understand how the hip moves. Turn back , bump, turn toward is not an alien move to humans.


It is not hard to pivot, keep a constant head position and hit the dickens out of the ball. Many of us have dabbled with Ballard, bought the book when it was still being published, and/or one of his videos. Less then impressed.
His left arm connection (accumulator #4) and early release (sweep release) are covered in The Golfing Machine and a whole lot more.
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Old 10-31-2005, 08:47 PM
Texsport Texsport is offline
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Originally Posted by 6bmike
And there in lies Ballards problem - teaching a sway. Ballard has a tough time understand how the hip moves. Turn back , bump, turn toward is not an alien move to humans.


It is not hard to pivot, keep a constant head position and hit the dickens out of the ball. Many of us have dabbled with Ballard, bought the book when it was still being published, and/or one of his videos. Less then impressed.
His left arm connection (accumulator #4) and early release (sweep release) are covered in The Golfing Machine and a whole lot more.
Ballard works for me! Very simple--the Golf Machine is not! I'd argue that Ballard does not teach a sway. Almost every great player in the world moves his/her head to the rear on the backswing--that's not a sway unless your weight gets back past the center of your rear foot!

I took a buch of lessons from a Harvey Pennick taught touring pro. He said Harvey's main key for him was to "get your left shoulder and head back over his right(back) knee on the backswing and then just let everything go toward the target".

On the subject of early release, I'll point out that neither Jack Nicklaus nor Tiger Woods holds off release, and in fact, both start releasing the clubhead early in their downswings.

Texsport

Last edited by Texsport : 10-31-2005 at 08:56 PM.
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Old 10-31-2005, 09:35 PM
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6bmike 6bmike is offline
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Originally Posted by Texsport
Ballard works for me! Very simple--the Golf Machine is not! I'd argue that Ballard does not teach a sway. Almost every great player in the world moves his/her head to the rear on the backswing--that's not a sway unless your weight gets back past the center of your rear foot!
I'm glad it does.
Quote:

I took a buch of lessons from a Harvey Pennick taught touring pro. He said Harvey's main key for him was to "get your left shoulder and head back over his right(back) knee on the backswing and then just let everything go toward the target".
Sounds like a nice pivot. Ballard doesn't believe in a pivot.
Quote:
On the subject of early release, I'll point out that neither Jack Nicklaus nor Tiger Woods holds off release, and in fact, both start releasing the clubhead early in their downswings.

Texsport
Yes, so does Watson- it is called a sweep release. Els, Hogan ans Sergio use a snap release. TGM explains all of this. Sweep relase is wonderful for a driver, less so for wedges- but you can. If you want I can show you pictures of Jack, Tiger and Watson using a snap release. Good golfers can perform move than one release.

I'm glad Ballard works for you. You say that TGM doesn't, since much of Ballard is explained in TGM book, what doesn't work for you? What is TGM swing in your opinion and who taught it to you?

Id just love to see Ballard swing the club just once- he doesn't on any of the tapes I have.
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Old 10-31-2005, 09:58 PM
Texsport Texsport is offline
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Originally Posted by 6bmike
I'm glad it does.


Sounds like a nice pivot. Ballard doesn't believe in a pivot.


Yes, so does Watson- it is called a sweep release. Els, Hogan ans Sergio use a snap release. TGM explains all of this. Sweep relase is wonderful for a driver, less so for wedges- but you can. If you want I can show you pictures of Jack, Tiger and Watson using a snap release. Good golfers can perform move than one release.

I'm glad Ballard works for you. You say that TGM doesn't, since much of Ballard is explained in TGM book, what doesn't work for you? What is TGM swing in your opinion and who taught it to you?

Id just love to see Ballard swing the club just once- he doesn't on any of the tapes I have.
It's not so much a case of parts of TGM that don't work as the whole, as Ballard working much better. I read TGM many times, marked the sections that seemed to pretain to my swing, tried to execute, but saw no improvement.I'm not a beginner, having had a handicap between +1 and -2 most of my life.

The snap release led to hooks for me, as it does/did for Els, Hogan and Sergio.

By the way, Ballard says the best golf swing in the world belongs to Annika Sorenstam--another sweep release player, if I'm not mistaken. Her swing seems to adhere to all of Ballard's principles closely.

My son is a PGA head club pro and he guided me to Ballard. No one has ever taught me TGM swing--attempted self learning.

Texsport

Last edited by Texsport : 10-31-2005 at 10:02 PM.
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Old 10-31-2005, 10:16 PM
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6bmike 6bmike is offline
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Originally Posted by Texsport
It's not so much a case of parts of TGM that don't work as the whole, as Ballard working much better. I read TGM many times, marked the sections that seemed to pretain to my swing, tried to execute, but saw no improvement.I'm not a beginner, having had a handicap between +1 and -2 most of my life.

The snap release led to hooks for me, as it does/did for Els, Hogan and Sergio.

By the way, Ballard says the best golf swing in the world belongs to Annika Sorenstam--another sweep release player, if I'm not mistaken.

My son is a PGA head club pro and he guided me to Ballard. No one has ever taught me TGM swing--attempted self learning.

Texsport

Snap release- some call it a delayed hit- leads to hooks? If Hogan, Els and Sergio hook the ball it isn't from their release.

The sweep release is a fine way to strike a ball. So is a snap release. Use whatever works best for you- that is the beauty of TGM- options.

How did you try to alter Ballard's swing with bookmarks from the book? Not everything is compatible. And why?

What improvement were you going for with such a low HC?

Everything in Ballard’s swing philosophy is covered in TGM. All is good, in fact he made a lot of money preaching accumulator number four. I still say he has no idea how hips function.
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