I think I might be gripping too high in the palm, need to get the shaft more under the heel to get a more free hinging action. I'm going to experiment on the range this weekend.
Woody
Just a heads up...
Careful with that one Chief. Putting the shaft more under the heel of your left hand is making an adjustment for more accumulator #3 (roll power) and effects clubface control. It has little effect on the #2 accumulator (velocity power) or wristcock which is clubhead control.
Increasing the #3 angle will require that you begin the roll sooner and widen the angle of approach.
I know it seems intuitive that wristcock is somehow increased by putting the shaft lower in the grip, but through impact you are transferring all of the wristcock momentum into clubface roll and the #3 angle you are proposing has consequences.
__________________
Bagger
1-H "Because of questions of all kinds, reams of additional detail must be made available - but separately, and probably endlessly." Homer Kelly
Just a heads up...
Careful with that one Chief. Putting the shaft more under the heel of your left hand is making an adjustment for more accumulator #3 (roll power) and effects clubface control. It has little effect on the #2 accumulator (velocity power) or wristcock which is clubhead control.
Increasing the #3 angle will require that you begin the roll sooner and widen the angle of approach.
I know it seems intuitive that wristcock is somehow increased by putting the shaft lower in the grip, but through impact you are transferring all of the wristcock momentum into clubface roll and the #3 angle you are proposing has consequences.
. good stuff man!
Also..
10-6-a...The Elbow Plane allows maximum #3 Accumulator requiring earlier Release per 6-N-0.
and since the elbow plane intersect the belt buckle.. the grip is stronger than usual in order for a level left wrist.. and a Sweep release... also facilitating a more behind the shaft Pressure point preparation....
and the Pressure point feeling more "under the shaft " for swinging..
Correct?
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God :God is love.
Latest incubator: Finally appreciate why Hogan wrote 19 pages on GRIP. I bet he could write another 40 pages.
Yes - Widening the Angle of Approach is accomplished by shallowing the plane.
Back to topic - My personal opinion about "frozen" is that once the right wrist is in position, it stays quiet. I think some players can handle a loosey goosie right wrist because they have enough pivot coordination and lag feel to bring it through impact bent and level.
For uncoordinated dorks like me, I need to feel the right wrist very stationary. Just one less thing to worry about.
__________________
Bagger
1-H "Because of questions of all kinds, reams of additional detail must be made available - but separately, and probably endlessly." Homer Kelly
Yes - Widening the Angle of Approach is accomplished by shallowing the plane.
Back to topic - My personal opinion about "frozen" is that once the right wrist is in position, it stays quiet. I think some players can handle a loosey goosie right wrist because they have enough pivot coordination and lag feel to bring it through impact bent and level.
For uncoordinated dorks like me, I need to feel the right wrist very stationary. Just one less thing to worry about.
I am with you there. I don't have the talent or the coordination to be able to handle a loosey goosie right wrist in my swing.
Alex
Burner thanks for your post. I don't see or feel my left wrist cock just by making a fist the way you described. But this has been a great thread for me. What I think I might need to work on to keep my right wrist level is adjusting my left hand grip: I think I might be gripping too high in the palm, need to get the shaft more under the heel to get a more free hinging action. I'm going to experiment on the range this weekend.
Woody
Woody,
I guess that is my point. You don't see or feel it because you don't realise that the wrist, in the condition I described, is "cocked".
You might also benefit, I know I did, from slackening off on your right hand grip.
Try keeping your right thumb off the club and your index finger just resting against the back of the grip rather than curled around it. You will still experience the support of PP#1 & PP#3 on the club shaft without your right hand overriding your left hand's club face control.
Shortening your back swing will also help you to guard against adding to the wrist cock as you move from the top of your swing to the end.
Cut the back swing off at the top - i.e hands at around the height of your right shoulder.
[Bagger] I think you are correct and I'm actually relieved because my left hand grip is one connection to the club that I feel very good about. I don't think my answer lies there. The shaft does lie somewhere between my palm and under the heel of my left hand and from my interpretation of what little Homer says on this in TGM this is where it should be most of the time, at least in a normal full swing. Still I am looking, looking, looking at how I can keep my right wrist level throughout a full swing and am studying your advice and others on this thread: great stuff here. I have much to learn and experiment with. I believe in the magic of the right forearm and my right wedge / wrist is wobbly at best. Developing...
[Burner] maybe I'm misunderstanding your description. I can make a fist while keeping my left wrist level and my wrist doesn't cock. In fact that's more of an uncocking motion to me or the fist is just pointed down. To cock from level I need to curl / squeeze my fingers toward my palm and it cocks up. Is this what you mean? I think one must be able to see the wrist in a cocked position. If I don't see my wrist cocked then it's not cocked because I know the difference between level, cocked, and uncocked. I'm not trying to be argumentative but you've completely lost me.
maybe I'm misunderstanding your description. I can make a fist while keeping my left wrist level and my wrist doesn't cock. In fact that's more of an uncocking motion to me or the fist is just pointed down. To cock from level I need to curl / squeeze my fingers toward my palm and it cocks up. Is this what you mean? I think one must be able to see the wrist in a cocked position. If I don't see my wrist cocked then it's not cocked because I know the difference between level, cocked, and uncocked. I'm not trying to be argumentative but you've completely lost me.
When I start out with a level left wrist and then make a really tight fist the left wrist cocks up. If I make a loose fist, the left wrist doesn't cock. Make a fist like you are trying to squeeze water out of a crow bar, that should do the trick. Unless you are Leslie Nielsen this would not describe the recommended grip pressure in a golf swing!
Matt
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"In my experience, if you stay with the essentials you WILL build a repeatable swing undoubtedly. If you can master the Imperatives you have a champion" (Vikram).
The reason you can't sustain the lag is because you are so eager to make the club move fast (a reaction to the intent of "hitting it far"). So on a full shot you throw it away too early, which doesn't happen for your short chip. (bts)
I got a funny feeling either your Std GRIP is too weak. or the club is too upright for you or you started Uncocked instead of Level to start with... thats why you are having wierd problem or maybe your left hand grip is aligned wrongly.. too much in the fingers , too loose left finger..to experience the wrong thing.
With the correct grip , flying wedge and correct RFT.. the pressure point 1 2( left thumb and last 3 finger) should load when first bending the right wrist and flattening the left wrist.. IF it doesn't your grip is wrong.. after loading 1 2 .. bend your right elbow up and down... and try to point that left thump towards you when you bend your elbow
__________________
God :God is love.
Latest incubator: Finally appreciate why Hogan wrote 19 pages on GRIP. I bet he could write another 40 pages.
[Burner] maybe I'm misunderstanding your description. I can make a fist while keeping my left wrist level and my wrist doesn't cock. In fact that's more of an uncocking motion to me or the fist is just pointed down. To cock from level I need to curl / squeeze my fingers toward my palm and it cocks up. Is this what you mean? I think one must be able to see the wrist in a cocked position. If I don't see my wrist cocked then it's not cocked because I know the difference between level, cocked, and uncocked. I'm not trying to be argumentative but you've completely lost me.
Hi Woody,
In a word, "Yup".
Its just the same as laying your forearm on a table with an open palm - back of the hand facing left and palm facing right; fingers pointing directly away from you.
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