Daryl,

We may be beating Daffy Duck to Deaf or Death, but where in the book does it say Hinge Action requires #3?

10-10-0 is titled Hinge Actions (Hinging)
In all the pictures associated with Hinging/Hinge Actions
the Hinge is mounted on the left shoulder, not the left wrist.

These are the three motions we are talking about
Horizontal, Angled, Vertical
regardless of maximum #3 or zero #3.

Sorting Through the Golf Nut's Catalog.

B-Ray

There's not much more I can add to be more clear. I bolded parts.

Great thread,

Yoda descibed my stroke with the hands too low as a "sea of compensation" :eyes: Feels really weird with the on-plane right forearm at fix. But also extremely solid through the ball. So now I am practicing basic motion in the garden. A little turf, a club and three balls is all that's needed.

Question:

What are the quality criteria as far as ball striking goes in basic motion?

I try to approach this as I would approach the short game. Solid ball contact, trajectory & distance control. With proper stroke execution. Just want to know if I have the right focus here. Maybe I should just pay attention to alignments an disregard the result?

Start with 3-F-5.

I like the "maybe I should" part...forget the ball.

Is my Left Wrist Flat?
Am I pointing at the Plane Line?
Did I arrive at the Both Arms Straight Position?

Thanks Ted,

Actually, the "sea of compensation" comment made a big difference to my motivation. A few years ago when I took lessons (sometimes frequently) I became used to hear that I was doing fine. It worked for quick fixes but not for building a proper stroke. And certainly not for self correction while playing. I guess the pros lowered their expectations because I'm a bit like Homer was. I need explicit & precise knowledge.

The thing I am sensing now while working on getting the right forearm on plane is that the lower the forearm is at fix compared to the inclined plane, the longer the right elbow will be below the inclined plane in the down stroke - and the longer I can drive effectively with my right hand. Does that make sense?

There is a substantial risk that I will keep drifting towards the old low hands' fix. But there is also a risk that I overdo the changes if I put my mind into not drifting back.

For a perfect impact fix: What should the (mirror) image of the right forearm on plane look like down the line? Should the clubshaft be parallell to the center of the forearm or should it point at the inside of the elbow joint or what?

I hope I'm not the only one who wants to know this.

Bernt,

I hope you don't mind my continued interruption, but I feel passionate about this. In my 40+ years of playing golf, NOTHING has had such a profound impact on my ball striking and understanding of alignments than the level left wrist and right forearm on plane has. NOTHING.

Hard work? You bet
Hard habits to break? You bet
Worth the time and energy? Every minute

I found this picture in Yoda's archives. Don't over-think this, just try to mirror this "feel" at first.

Kevin

mirror parallax
 

When the Right Forearm is placed ON Plane at Fix, it gives you a new Right Shoulder Location. If the Right Shoulder starts too high, as in 99.999999999 percent of golfers, you run out of Right Arm before you get to the ball. Most start with a straight Right Arm at Address and return to Impact with a straight Right Arm. It's really powerful. :liar:

Hold the Right Forearm and Clubshaft in-line with a Bent Right Wrist on a horizontal Plane. Look at that relationship in the mirror, and then lower the Right Arm and club to the ball.

The best-case scenario is a video camera, a computer with software, and a monitor near the ball. This would eliminate the mirror parallax. In the mirror, the eyes are off Plane, making it difficult to draw conclusions.

BG Address Position For Lefties
 

Here is BG's Address Position (not Fix), mirrored for lefties.

:salut:

Why do you assume hinge action OR motion means anything other than compression (chapter 2)?

Clubface control. I don't care if you use your elbow or your toes to hold the club, if you impact the ball, from impact to separation, there is a hinge action - the type of action determines the efficiency of compression.

Closing only - horizontal
Closing and layback - angled
layback only - vertical

It has nothing at all to do with the amount of #3, it is all about how the ball and clubface come into contact, compress or leak, and separate.

While it may be best monitored via the left wrist - it is, and always will be, chapter 2.

The ball only knows what the club tells it.

This explanation was a revelation to me, Luke!

I had to go out in the garden and try a few strokes. Your description fits perfectly with what I always do. I've done it on purpose for years and it has become second nature. With all clubs but the putter. It is buried in my golfing soul to so. Probably a compensation from the early days where my left side had a tendency to quit. I am as lefty as they come and it is almost a miracle that my right side is able to hold on to the club as well as it is. I was able to hit the ball about 165 yards or so with a 5 iron in my first season - with a follow thru of about 5 inches towards the target and 2-3 inches towards china.

Anyway, after reading your post I was able to take a stance with a level right forearm. I've always braced the left side with my right arm. And I have done it by pushing from the right shoulder. By thinking of the "arm" I needed to low point it just felt right to ease up the right shoulder. The left side feels a lot looser now and in a state of relatively flimsy way, but for the first time that I can remember I can feel balanced and relaxed with a level right forearm at address. Heck, I could even "see" the shot. So I had to do a couple of strokes too. And I could feel extra power through the ball. Didn't have to do more than two to be absolutely certain that I'm on to something that is important and for real.

Now where are those revelation smileys when you need them?

Yoda,

Many thanks for the Brian Gay mirror image Yoda. I think it is time for me to change my screen saver.:-)

Even with a new level right forearm I still have got my right elbow somehow covered by the right hip. But now that I am able to level my right forearm without feeling like a battle of opposing forces on the inside maybe I can do something about that too. It's not that I haven't been aware that my setup and stance have been odd. It's just that I have never been able to do what the good players do and still be able to hit the ball.

This is possibly the best diagnostic piece of golfing advice ever that has made it all the way into my stubborn, need-to-understand-everything head. You cleared the path with your shotgun diagnosis, Yoda. I hope you take it as a compliment cause I wouldn't have accepted it on face value from many people in the world. And your post just nailed it YodasLuke.

I have a feeling that this was a huge milestone for me. And I am very grateful and in the mood for celebration.

:occasion: