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-   -   Elkington sequence (http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1978)

strav 12-30-2005 02:27 AM

Elkington sequence
 


What components or principles of TGM do you see demonstrated or violated in the above sequence?

hue 12-30-2005 05:28 AM

He is not swinging on plane in the followthrough. He bends the plane line right in a steering move in the followthrough .In pics 6,7, and 8 he is above plane.Pics 7and 8 (Bottom pics) indicate that there has been some flipping also.

annikan skywalker 12-30-2005 06:53 AM

He's on the Hands Only Plane which requires a lot of pivot motion in the follow-through..and with that sharp of a #3Acc Angle with Layback requires the Hand Path to keep going around the corner!!!!

strav 12-30-2005 08:55 AM

Thanks for the observations guys. Pardon my ignorance but,
Hue when you say he is bending the plane line right are you basing this on the above plane positions in pics 6, 7 and 8? Why is this of any consequence when the ball has separated from the club by pic 5?

Annikan are you saying he is compelled to be where he is with the hands "disappearing" because of the hinge action employed and the sharp angle between the left forearm and the clubshaft shortly before impact and if so is this desirable?

annikan skywalker 12-30-2005 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strav
Thanks for the observations guys. Pardon my ignorance but,
Hue when you say he is bending the plane line right are you basing this on the above plane positions in pics 6, 7 and 8? Why is this of any consequence when the ball has separated from the club by pic 5?

Annikan are you saying he is compelled to be where he is with the hands "disappearing" because of the hinge action employed and the sharp angle between the left forearm and the clubshaft shortly before impact and if so is this desirable?

He just needs to go a little more left with the hands and it would be pointing at the plane line.....even being on the hands only plane ....Staying in yur waist Bend longer than usual and Pivoting the Right Shoulder furhter forwaard would mandate the handpath to go more left...and end up on the "heel line" at finish...


Hands Only plane is great for little lobs and pitches...especialy with "manageable throwaway' and shortening the radius via "cracking the elbows around the ribcage"...this creates layback and a loss of the compression point...this is the "Modus Operandi" for a lot of advanced players...as oppossed to goin to both arm straight which maintains the compression point longer...

hue 12-30-2005 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strav
Thanks for the observations guys. Pardon my ignorance but,
Hue when you say he is bending the plane line right are you basing this on the above plane positions in pics 6, 7 and 8? Why is this of any consequence when the ball has separated from the club by pic 5?

You are either swinging on plane or not. Elkington is not on plane in these pics. Where he ends up on pics 8,7 and 6 has been inluenced by what was going on in pic 5.

birdie_man 12-30-2005 04:49 PM

To me, that doesn't look like much of a flip (lag leakage).

?

I don't think it's that bad.....especially since it's a pitch.....as Annikan talked about.

Look at Fr. 5 in the face-on seq.

EC 12-30-2005 08:23 PM

Get a Life!!!!!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by strav

What components or principles of TGM do you see demonstrated or violated in the above sequence?


You cannot possibly say without knowing his intentions! My guess, a player of his caliber and knowledge is pretty certain of what he is trying to achieve. We all should wish to be as competent as Steve!

EC

Yoda 12-30-2005 11:39 PM

Steve Elkington's Wonderful Little TGM Stroke
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by strav


What components or principles of TGM do you see demonstrated or violated in the above sequence?

Steve Elkington is playing a little Cut Shot here (2-C-2). Actually, with the Ball located almost under his Left Shoulder and with the Clubhead very low and 'brushing the ground' just prior to Impact, it is apparent that he is playing a Lob Shot (2-C-3). This is a variation of the Cut Shot where the Ball is struck at or very near Low Point and hence no divot is taken. He is Tracing an Open Plane Line from an Open Stance (Open-Open / 10-5-D) with his Right Forearm and #3 Pressure Point (5-0), thus assuring he remains On Plane 'Through the Ball' (7-24). To attack the close-cut Flagstick, he has Opened his Clubface (Grip Rotation / 7-2) and is using Dual Vertical Hinge Action (10-10-E) to produce maximum Clubface Layback and a high, soft Shot (The Computer / 14-0).

To insure precision and minimize error in this most delicate shot, he starts from the Special Address Position (10-9-D). This means that the Body is in its Open Impact Fix position and the Hands are in the classic Standard Address location and condition (Hands mid-Body with Left Wrist Bent and Right Wrist Flat / 9-2-1 #1 per 10-9-A). His Head is Centered between his Feet (9-1-3) and remains Stationary through Impact (9-1-10) and the Follow-Through (9-1-11). He doesn’t Bob (3-F-7-C), and he doesn’t Sway (3-F-7-D). In addition to the Open Stance, his entire Body is Open to the Target Line (Special Fix 10-8-B) instead of the normal 'comparatively squared away' alignment (Standard Fix 10-8-A). These alignments automatically restrict the Backstroke Motion but allow for an unrestricted Follow-Through (Delayed Pivot 10-12-C). All this promotes the Underhand Pitch motion and Feel (2-N-0) so essential to maintaining the Clubshaft On Line and On Plane (12-3-0 #37/38/39) during the Release Interval (Sections 8-9/10/11).

Steve is Swinging here and thus accelerating the Club Longitudinally (10-19-C) from the Top (8-6 per 10-21-B). In other words, he is Pulling the Club lengthwise -- as if the Clubshaft were a piece of string --toward the Base Line (10-5-0) of the Inclined Plane (2-F). Although it is impossible to tell from the photos, it is highly possible that the Drag Load was accomplished by the 'gentle, even lazy' Float Motion of 10-19-B. He is using the Swinger's Standard Wrist Action (10-18-A) with its Start Up and Release Swivels and a Sequenced Release (Left Wrist Uncock - Left Hand Roll / 4-D-0) Triggered by the Left Wrist Throw (10-20-E). This is a Three Accumulator Stroke -- #4 (Left Arm); #2 (Left Wristcock); and #3 (Left Hand Turn and Roll) -- but not for maximum Power (2-M-1).

To this end, he is minimizing Effective Clubhead Mass by using a very light Lag Pressure (low Clubhead Acceleration Rate / 2-M-2-1) with a Short-Shafted Club that he makes shorter still by gripping down slightly (length of Lever / 2-M-2-2). In addition, to reduce Clubhead Speed, he employs a Side Power Package Assembly Point per 10-21-B (short Length of Stroke producing reduced Acceleration Time / 2-M-2-3). Further, he uses an Automatic Random Sweep Release (10-24-C) to increase the length of the Release Arc (Release Interval / 2-M-2-4), thus increasing the Clubhead’s travel time (from Release to Impact) and decreasing its travel rate (6-N-0) for the given Hand Speed (Pace / 6-P-0). This minimizes the increase in Clubhead Speed inherent in the Endless Belt Effect (2-K#6) and its characteristic change from Linear Speed to Angular Speed during the Pulley Wheel Encounter (7-23).

In the Start Down and Downstroke, he avoids the Golfer’s Public Enemy #1 – Clubhead Throwaway (6-D-0/1/2/3)-- and its inevitable Over-Acceleration, Quitting and inability to Sustain the Lag (3-F-7-B). Thus, near Impact, we are presented with the visual clues of a Three-Dimensional Compression (2-C-0): the Forward Lean of the Clubshaft (2-J-2) and the Flat Left Wrist (4-D-1). Through the Release Interval, the Head rotates naturally with the Body Turn. From Impact (8-10) to Follow-Through (8-11), the Dual Vertical Hinge Action holds the Flat Left Wrist perpendicular to the Vertical Plane and produces its abbreviated Rhythm (In Line Left Arm-Clubshaft Motion and Clubhead Travel per 2-G). Finally, with the Centrifugal Acceleration and Momentum phases complete (Law of the Flail / 2-K), the Clubshaft passes its In Line Condition with the Left Arm and Deceleration begins. At the Finish (8-12), the compliant Body has responded beautifully to Educated Hands (4-0, 5-0) and is poised and Balanced (12-3-0 #45).

Hats off to Steve Elkington and his very fine Golf Stroke!

tobell 12-31-2005 01:23 AM

Hats off to Yoda and Elk
 
Quote:

To this end, he is minimizing Effective Clubhead Mass by using a very light Lag Pressure (low Clubhead Acceleration Rate / 2-M-2-1) with a Short-Shafted Club that he makes shorter still by gripping down slightly (length of Lever / 2-M-2-2). In addition, to reduce Clubhead Speed, he employs a Side Power Package Assembly Point per 10-21-B (short Length of Stroke producing reduced Acceleration Time / 2-M-2-3). Further, he uses an Automatic Random Sweep Release (10-24-C) to increase the length of the Release Arc (Release Interval / 2-M-2-4), thus increasing the Clubhead’s travel time (from Release to Impact) and decreasing its travel rate (6-N-0) for the given Hand Speed (Pace / 6-P-0). This minimizes the increase in Clubhead Speed inherent in the Endless Belt Effect (2-K#6) and its characteristic change from Linear Speed to Angular Speed during the Pulley Wheel Encounter (7-23).
Two pros deftly performing their craft, thanks to both Elkington and Yoda.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda
Side Power Package Assembly Point per 10-21-B (short Length of Stroke producing reduced Acceleration Time / 2-M-2-3).

-- very helpful!

Thanks

comdpa 12-31-2005 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda
...
Hats off to Steve Elkington and his very fine Golf Stroke!

Geez, that is a wonderful swing analysis based on TGM terminology!

hue 12-31-2005 06:45 AM

Lynn, Can you give me your thoughts on Elkington's followthrough? To me he is above plane. When I play this type of shot my tendency is to end up in a similar type position but have been working on my basic and aquired motions with all hinge actions being on plane. I am looking forward to your's and vj's short game videos to give me a better idea what I SHOULD be doing around the green.

strav 12-31-2005 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda

Hats off to Steve Elkington and his very fine Golf Stroke!

Thanks Yoda for that detailed analysis. As usual nothing but top-flight. Once again you have given us much to study and absorb.

Martee 12-31-2005 11:40 AM

Wow! That is a terrific piece of analysis. Concise and has one heck of a lot of info.

This will make for a good study.

Thanks...

Yoda 12-31-2005 11:44 AM

Encore!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tobell

Two pros deftly performing their craft, thanks to both Elkington and Yoda.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comdpa

Geez, that is a wonderful swing analysis based on TGM terminology!


Quote:

Originally Posted by strav

Thanks Yoda for that detailed analysis. As usual nothing but top-flight. Once again you have given us much to study and absorb.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martee

This will make for a good study.


Thanks, Tobell, Comdpa, Strav and Martee. I do think this is a worthwhile TGM Study, so I fleshed out certain parts and added additional references this morning. Consequently, early readers may wish to review it again.

Rob2197 12-31-2005 04:10 PM

?
 
Yoda,

Oh great one, I'm a little confused. I don't even pretend to know as much about TGM as you do. In fact, I'm just a rank beginner myself.

But I thought that one of the main dangers of TGM was trying to mix in components of swinging with hitting and vice versa.

That being said, Elkington has a very early wrist cock in this pictures that is vindicative of swinging style.

But a swinger should turn the shoulders around a pivot point instead of using arms on downswing, right?

Looks like both swinging on takeaway but more of hitting on downswing. Either way there is very little shoulder turn.

Rob2197 12-31-2005 04:14 PM

Oops!
 
Sorry, just noticed the front on view. It shows that Mr. Elkington does indeed have a good shoulder turn on the follow through. Please forgive my ignorance.

So I'm assuming that this is a shot around the green performed by a swinger. Hmmm, how it differ for a hitter? I'm assuming less wrist cock off the takeaway, but what else if anything should be different.

4 barrels 01-01-2006 12:27 AM

Nice explaination Lynn, most instructors meerly describe his swing as rythmical etc. etc. You have explained why in pointing out the components and variations used to achieve his pattern and their relationships within the stroke.

We would all rather hear this than the garbage tv announcers get away with saying.

Rhythm 01-01-2006 01:25 PM

Nice
 
Great explanation Lynn! Very educational.

Chris

strav 01-02-2006 10:12 AM

The Break and Lock
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob2197
..just noticed the front on view. It shows that Mr. Elkington does indeed have a good shoulder turn on the follow through.

Steve plays nearly all chips and pitches with most of the weight on the left foot to ensure a descending blow.
For the higher shots around the green, he uses what he calls the Break and Lock, or the Break/Don’t Break. This method is powered primarily by the shoulders, with a very small hip rotation.
In his words, he breaks or cocks the wrists on the backswing, then powers them forward with the shoulders and hips without uncocking on the downswing or even after the hit. He also maintains that the right hand should never pass the left.
The shoulders in his Break and Lock swing turn a little more parallel to the ground than in the full swing. This gives the club a shallower path and ensures good, crisp contact. (From Five Fundamentals.)

Trig 01-02-2006 11:36 AM

Thanks Yoda
 
Yoda - thanks for taking the time to analyze the Elk sequence with TGM references. Together, the pics and your analysis make a for a great learning tool. :)

annikan skywalker 01-02-2006 02:47 PM

Lynn....

Your analysis was like a real "Homer"

Henry Aaron - 715
Lynn Blake - 2500

AS

YodasLuke 01-07-2006 01:49 PM

the best button on the remote
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 4 barrels
Nice explaination Lynn, most instructors meerly describe his swing as rythmical etc. etc. You have explained why in pointing out the components and variations used to achieve his pattern and their relationships within the stroke.

We would all rather hear this than the garbage tv announcers get away with saying.

I love to watch golf on T.V., but I love it more when it's on MUTE!

birdie_man 03-25-2006 05:10 PM

Am I the only one who can't see the sequences in the first post?....I used to be able to see them.

hue 03-25-2006 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by birdie_man
Am I the only one who can't see the sequences in the first post?....I used to be able to see them.

I can't see them.

Quintin van der Berg 01-23-2008 07:42 AM

no picture
 
Hi YODA.

I cannot seem to see the picture. Is it possible you can repost this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda (Post 17099)
Steve Elkington is playing a little Cut Shot here (2-C-2). Actually, with the Ball located almost under his Left Shoulder and with the Clubhead very low and 'brushing the ground' just prior to Impact, it is apparent that he is playing a Lob Shot (2-C-3). This is a variation of the Cut Shot where the Ball is struck at or very near Low Point and hence no divot is taken. He is Tracing an Open Plane Line from an Open Stance (Open-Open / 10-5-D) with his Right Forearm and #3 Pressure Point (5-0), thus assuring he remains On Plane 'Through the Ball' (7-24). To attack the close-cut Flagstick, he has Opened his Clubface (Grip Rotation / 7-2) and is using Dual Vertical Hinge Action (10-10-E) to produce maximum Clubface Layback and a high, soft Shot (The Computer / 14-0).

To insure precision and minimize error in this most delicate shot, he starts from the Special Address Position (10-9-D). This means that the Body is in its Open Impact Fix position and the Hands are in the classic Standard Address location and condition (Hands mid-Body with Left Wrist Bent and Right Wrist Flat / 9-2-1 #1 per 10-9-A). His Head is Centered between his Feet (9-1-3) and remains Stationary through Impact (9-1-10) and the Follow-Through (9-1-11). He doesn’t Bob (3-F-7-C), and he doesn’t Sway (3-F-7-D). In addition to the Open Stance, his entire Body is Open to the Target Line (Special Fix 10-8-B) instead of the normal 'comparatively squared away' alignment (Standard Fix 10-8-A). These alignments automatically restrict the Backstroke Motion but allow for an unrestricted Follow-Through (Delayed Pivot 10-12-C). All this promotes the Underhand Pitch motion and Feel (2-N-0) so essential to maintaining the Clubshaft On Line and On Plane (12-3-0 #37/38/39) during the Release Interval (Sections 8-9/10/11).

Steve is Swinging here and thus accelerating the Club Longitudinally (10-19-C) from the Top (8-6 per 10-21-B). In other words, he is Pulling the Club lengthwise -- as if the Clubshaft were a piece of string --toward the Base Line (10-5-0) of the Inclined Plane (2-F). Although it is impossible to tell from the photos, it is highly possible that the Drag Load was accomplished by the 'gentle, even lazy' Float Motion of 10-19-B. He is using the Swinger's Standard Wrist Action (10-18-A) with its Start Up and Release Swivels and a Sequenced Release (Left Wrist Uncock - Left Hand Roll / 4-D-0) Triggered by the Left Wrist Throw (10-20-E). This is a Three Accumulator Stroke -- #4 (Left Arm); #2 (Left Wristcock); and #3 (Left Hand Turn and Roll) -- but not for maximum Power (2-M-1).

To this end, he is minimizing Effective Clubhead Mass by using a very light Lag Pressure (low Clubhead Acceleration Rate / 2-M-2-1) with a Short-Shafted Club that he makes shorter still by gripping down slightly (length of Lever / 2-M-2-2). In addition, to reduce Clubhead Speed, he employs a Side Power Package Assembly Point per 10-21-B (short Length of Stroke producing reduced Acceleration Time / 2-M-2-3). Further, he uses an Automatic Random Sweep Release (10-24-C) to increase the length of the Release Arc (Release Interval / 2-M-2-4), thus increasing the Clubhead’s travel time (from Release to Impact) and decreasing its travel rate (6-N-0) for the given Hand Speed (Pace / 6-P-0). This minimizes the increase in Clubhead Speed inherent in the Endless Belt Effect (2-K#6) and its characteristic change from Linear Speed to Angular Speed during the Pulley Wheel Encounter (7-23).

In the Start Down and Downstroke, he avoids the Golfer’s Public Enemy #1 – Clubhead Throwaway (6-D-0/1/2/3)-- and its inevitable Over-Acceleration, Quitting and inability to Sustain the Lag (3-F-7-B). Thus, near Impact, we are presented with the visual clues of a Three-Dimensional Compression (2-C-0): the Forward Lean of the Clubshaft (2-J-2) and the Flat Left Wrist (4-D-1). Through the Release Interval, the Head rotates naturally with the Body Turn. From Impact (8-10) to Follow-Through (8-11), the Dual Vertical Hinge Action holds the Flat Left Wrist perpendicular to the Vertical Plane and produces its abbreviated Rhythm (In Line Left Arm-Clubshaft Motion and Clubhead Travel per 2-G). Finally, with the Centrifugal Acceleration and Momentum phases complete (Law of the Flail / 2-K), the Clubshaft passes its In Line Condition with the Left Arm and Deceleration begins. At the Finish (8-12), the compliant Body has responded beautifully to Educated Hands (4-0, 5-0) and is poised and Balanced (12-3-0 #45).

Hats off to Steve Elkington and his very fine Golf Stroke!


Bagger Lance 01-23-2008 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quintin van der Berg (Post 48065)
Hi YODA.

I cannot seem to see the picture. Is it possible you can repost this.

Quintin,

Strav put the link to the picture in his post and now the link to that other server hosting the picture is no longer active. He would need to re-edit his post to provide a valid path to the picture. We don't have the picture on this site or we would put it up.

strav 01-25-2008 06:43 AM

Repost
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bagger Lance (Post 48069)
Quintin,

Strav put the link to the picture in his post and now the link to that other server hosting the picture is no longer active. He would need to re-edit his post to provide a valid path to the picture. We don't have the picture on this site or we would put it up.

Hi Bagger
I've reposted the image. It should work now .

Bagger Lance 01-25-2008 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strav (Post 48182)
Hi Bagger
I've reposted the image. It should work now .

Thanks Mate!


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