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-   -   Club Face Control (http://www.lynnblakegolf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6498)

driver 04-06-2009 08:53 PM

Club Face Control
 
It is said within the TGM, the Left Arm Wrist Roll controls the club face through impact, and I guess this is a basic principal which I understand. However I am wondering, in a non automatic release, which hand would be the dominant one in actuating this wrist roll through the ball. Or does it come down to personal choice. I have been experimenting with this using p/p 3 to initiate the roll into the ball, this gives me a feeling of being more in control, but I tend to hit the ball fat. Does anyone have some thoughts on this subject?

O.B.Left 04-07-2009 08:26 PM

"Measure twice, cut once"
 
Hey Driver

That question covers a lot of different topics. I think much of this can be researched best by using the search function. Here are some suggestions for key words :

-"hinge action"

- "swivel"

-"release triggers"

-"geometry of the circle"

In regard to hitting it fat; I would say that with a Level Left Wrist at Fix, Extensor Action and a steady left shoulder (achieved via a steady non bobbing or swaying Head) hitting it fat should be near impossible.

To draw a perfect circle you must have a fixed center and a properly extended radius. Like a string line from nail to pencil used by a carpenter to draw a curve, the left arm and club (Primary Lever Assembly, the radius) must be held taut via extensor action at fix to properly measure the correct distance from the Left Shoulder (center) to the ball. Once measured, nail the Left Shoulder or the Head into position.

If the Left Wrist is cocked slightly at Fix (slack in the string, bad measurement) and then stretched to a fuller extension dynamically during the swing OR if your Left Shoulder moves closer to the ball during the swing (not nailed).......you'll hit it fat. If you measure properly and nail it down but then let your string (Primary Lever Assembly) go slack during the swing you'll hit it thin. Most people encountering this latter situation develop a head bob or lowering as a compensation. This works to the extent that they can maintain a consistent radius with an un stretched Primary Lever Assembly.........which is hightly doubtful........... for that reason the carpenter uses a taut string line and so should we.

The added benefit to Extensor Action is increased velocity via a wider arc, increased structure and mass which adds to the blow to the ball. Velocity and mass, every golfer has to like that.

Hope this helps.

purehitter 04-08-2009 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.B.Left (Post 62420)
Hey Driver

That question covers a lot of different topics. I think much of this can be researched best by using the search function. Here are some suggestions for key words :

-"hinge action"

- "swivel"

-"release triggers"

-"geometry of the circle"

In regard to hitting it fat; I would say that with a Level Left Wrist at Fix, Extensor Action and a steady left shoulder (achieved via a steady non bobbing or swaying Head) hitting it fat should be near impossible.

To draw a perfect circle you must have a fixed center. Like a string line from nail to pencil used by a carpenter to draw a curve or radius, the left arm and club (Primary Lever Assembly) must be held taut via extensor action at fix to properly measure the correct distance from the Left Shoulder (center) to the ball. Once measured nail the Left Shoulder or the Head into position.

If the Left Wrist is cocked slightly at Fix (bad measurement) and then stretched to a fuller extension dynamically during the swing OR if your Left Shoulder moves closer to the ball during the swing (not nailed).......you'll hit it fat. If you measure properly and nail it down but then let your string (Primary Lever Assembly) go slack during the swing you'll hit it thin. Most people encountering this latter situation develop a head bob or lowering as a compensation. This works to the extent that they can maintain a consistent radius with an un stretched Primary Lever Assembly.........which is hightly doubtful........... for that reason the carpenter uses a taut string line and so should we.

The added benefit to Extensor Action is increased velocity via a wider arc, increased structure and mass which adds to the blow to the ball. Velocity and mass, every golfer has to like that.

Hope this helps.

Extensor action is important to solid sweet spot impact if done correctly. Many golfers will apply just the push of the right arm without a slight pull of the left arm and this can change the radius of the left arm. The results are fat shots. Make sure you have opposite pull of the left arm to the pushing right arm to maintain the same radius of the left arm when applying extensor action. Fat shots will be a thing of the past.

Andy R 04-08-2009 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by purehitter (Post 62427)
Extensor action is important to solid sweet spot impact if done correctly. Many golfers will apply just the push of the right arm without a slight pull of the left arm and this can change the radius of the left arm. The results are fat shots. Make sure you have opposite pull of the left arm to the pushing right arm to maintain the same radius of the left arm when applying extensor action. Fat shots will be a thing of the past.

Bold by Andy R

I can't remember reading or hearing Mr Kelly say anything about the "opposite pull of the left arm" with regard to Extensor Action. I'd love to hear what he had to say about that, though. Can you let me know where you heard or read that? Thanks in advance.

purehitter 04-08-2009 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy R (Post 62436)
Bold by Andy R

I can't remember reading or hearing Mr Kelly say anything about the "opposite pull of the left arm" with regard to Extensor Action. I'd love to hear what he had to say about that, though. Can you let me know where you heard or read that? Thanks in advance.

I did not hear it from any one. I have been teaching it for 20 years. Give it a try. It works.

powerdraw 04-09-2009 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by purehitter (Post 62439)
I did not hear it from any one. I have been teaching it for 20 years. Give it a try. It works.

i developpend shank city trying this, but its probably my fault, coz as my focus changed doing this, the swing thoughts change so i probably started manipulating the club instead of letting law work for me.

maybe i just did it wrong Pure?

garagefan66 04-09-2009 09:22 AM

Works great for me. The left arm pull is very slight, just enough to keep me from pulling my arm out of socket. Great structure and a little more right arm bend.

powerdraw 04-09-2009 12:47 PM

i might be overdoing it...take the pill not the bottle thing?

okie 04-09-2009 01:15 PM

Nice!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by O.B.Left (Post 62420)
Hey Driver

That question covers a lot of different topics. I think much of this can be researched best by using the search function. Here are some suggestions for key words :

-"hinge action"

- "swivel"

-"release triggers"

-"geometry of the circle"

In regard to hitting it fat; I would say that with a Level Left Wrist at Fix, Extensor Action and a steady left shoulder (achieved via a steady non bobbing or swaying Head) hitting it fat should be near impossible.

To draw a perfect circle you must have a fixed center and a properly extended radius. Like a string line from nail to pencil used by a carpenter to draw a curve, the left arm and club (Primary Lever Assembly, the radius) must be held taut via extensor action at fix to properly measure the correct distance from the Left Shoulder (center) to the ball. Once measured, nail the Left Shoulder or the Head into position.

If the Left Wrist is cocked slightly at Fix (slack in the string, bad measurement) and then stretched to a fuller extension dynamically during the swing OR if your Left Shoulder moves closer to the ball during the swing (not nailed).......you'll hit it fat. If you measure properly and nail it down but then let your string (Primary Lever Assembly) go slack during the swing you'll hit it thin. Most people encountering this latter situation develop a head bob or lowering as a compensation. This works to the extent that they can maintain a consistent radius with an un stretched Primary Lever Assembly.........which is hightly doubtful........... for that reason the carpenter uses a taut string line and so should we.

The added benefit to Extensor Action is increased velocity via a wider arc, increased structure and mass which adds to the blow to the ball. Velocity and mass, every golfer has to like that.

Hope this helps.

Nice primer, OB!

Andy R 04-09-2009 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by purehitter (Post 62427)
Extensor action is important to solid sweet spot impact if done correctly. Many golfers will apply just the push of the right arm without a slight pull of the left arm and this can change the radius of the left arm. The results are fat shots. Make sure you have opposite pull of the left arm to the pushing right arm to maintain the same radius of the left arm when applying extensor action. Fat shots will be a thing of the past.

Bold by Andy R

Quote:

Originally Posted by purehitter (Post 62439)
I did not hear it from any one. I have been teaching it for 20 years. Give it a try. It works.

Ah, ok, it sounded like that was part of the definition of Extensor Action.

Maybe when defining a TGM term like Extensor Action it would be better to say something like "Extensor Action is.... etc" but I teach a modified version of it "by adding... etc."

I don't mean to be disrespectful, or anything, it's just that TGM is confusing enough as it is. :laughing9

Burner 04-09-2009 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy R (Post 62453)
Bold by Andy R



Ah, ok, it sounded like that was part of the definition of Extensor Action.

Maybe when defining a TGM term like Extensor Action it would be better to say something like "Extensor Action is.... etc" but I teach a modified version of it "by adding... etc."

I don't mean to be disrespectful, or anything, it's just that TGM is confusing enough as it is. :laughing9

Mr Kelley referred to the "checkrein" action of the left arm, where it applies a constant resistance to the effort the right arm makes to straighten.

Confusion arises from guys thinking that extensor action is the right arm pulling, and keeping, the left arm straight; whereas it is the left arm preventing the straightening of the right arm.

Mr Kelley did not deal in confusion: that only occurs in individual interpretations of what he was very specific about.

purehitter 04-09-2009 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy R (Post 62453)
Bold by Andy R



Ah, ok, it sounded like that was part of the definition of Extensor Action.

Maybe when defining a TGM term like Extensor Action it would be better to say something like "Extensor Action is.... etc" but I teach a modified version of it "by adding... etc."

I don't mean to be disrespectful, or anything, it's just that TGM is confusing enough as it is. :laughing9

I understand there is allot of info in TGM book. If you do the extensor action by the TGM book the radius can change. So add a little pull from the left arm to keep the left arm from growing too much. It helps big time for many golfers.

okie 04-09-2009 06:47 PM

Huh?
 
How many inches do you think the left arm grows as a result of our favorite phenomenal fictitious force? I doubt that max extention of the left arm (as long as it is maintained start to finish) can be a bad thing.

Andy R 04-10-2009 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burner (Post 62457)
Mr Kelley referred to the "checkrein" action of the left arm, where it applies a constant resistance to the effort the right arm makes to straighten.

Confusion arises from guys thinking that extensor action is the right arm pulling, and keeping, the left arm straight; whereas it is the left arm preventing the straightening of the right arm.

Mr Kelley did not deal in confusion: that only occurs in individual interpretations of what he was very specific about.

Thats a great post and clears up some of my confusion about Extensor Action. Now I see 1-L-15 simply as a continuation of proper Extensor Action. Great stuff. :)


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