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CF in hitting.
Do U include any cf in your hitting procedure? if so, where, how, and how much?
hb |
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Bumpy |
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Back to your regularly scheduled program: Quote:
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hb |
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Hb |
MizunoJoe,
There is only one requirement for CF to be present in a golf stroke. And that requirement is strictly geometrical. Any time the club head has a somewhat curved path (which is basically all the time from top to finish) there will be CF present. Hitting or swinging doesn't make a difference. CF is nothing more (and nothing less) than club head inertia's response to an inward pulling effort (the other CF, Centripetal Force). The swinger manipulates these CF's to harness & control the throw-out and thereby the release. The hitter relies less on CF manipulation and more on muscle force to release the club and square up the club face, but both CF's are still present, has to be negotiated and is a key enabler to an efficient stroke with a chain reaction like release. |
I agree.
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http://youtu.be/c3C1__L5usM http://youtu.be/1y2fH0ooCoQ ICT |
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2-K, -A. Centripetal Force (the Lever Assemblies 6-A) diverting Linear Force (Right Arm Thrust 6-B-1) into a rotating motion ( Hitting 10-19-A). hb |
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HB |
Standard wrist action with Hitting???
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"Rotation induces a Throw-Out action...Throw-Out action is termed herein as "Centrifugal Acceleration" to indicate that Centrifugal Force(Centrifugal Reaction), not muscle, is propelling the Secondary Lever Assembly(the Golf Club) into Impact. So Swingers are totally dependent on their skill at manipulating Centrifugal Force while Hitters are not." If muscle is propelling the Golf Club into Impact, Centrifugal Force is not - they are mutually exclusive. Hitters are not dependent on CF manipulation because it isn't present. |
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Stop "cherry picking" words - read 2-K - including heading - Check the GLOSSARY HB |
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But the diff between swinging and hitting starts early in the bs for me. Single vs standard wrist action is essential for the loading condition of pp#1 & pp#3 in the down swing. More of a "reverse dual horizontal" wrist action in the back swing with plenty of lag between pivot and hands for the swing. And more pivot rotation to create dual horizontal or angle hinge for the hitting back swing. I can probably do as long back swing while hitting as swinging, but then I need more shoulder turn for the hit, to get the right shoulder in position to drive the hands down plane. The swing feels more like a drop of the hands under the plane of the right shoulder to me. It's a feel thing, I know, but there is a geometrical difference right shoulder to hands between hitting and swinging and not only the PP#3 rotation. At least for me. If you want to hit, you need to rotate pp#1 & #3 back on plane before the release. And for a 3 barrel hit, you probably should aim to keep it on plane at all times. Just my 2cents. I have a feeling that Yoda would have a more systematic and general take on this, with more room for variation. Perhaps OB.Left too. He has a lot of ideas & knowledge about different styles of hitting. Fascinating stuff. |
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Vary the Loading Action by Varying the Right Elbow Alignment. See Magic of the Right Forearm. At the End of Start-up, choose either to Pitch the Elbow (Standard Wrist Action) to load the Secondary Lever (Shaft), or raise the Elbow (Single Wrist Action) to Load the Primary Lever (Left Arm and Shaft). Note that regardless of Loading action or Swinging or Hitting, the Impact Alignments are identical. The Flying Wedges are aligned at Right Angles, the Left Wrist is Flat and Level, the Right Wrist is Bent and Level, the Right Forearm is On-Plane, etc. Note also, that because the Primary Lever is "Loaded", it cannot Swing (Throwout) although it will and should be pulled. If you make the mistake of trying to swing the Left Arm, the #3 PP will "Un-Load". Swinging is Harnessing CF. Hitting is Overpowering CF. It's still there, it's no longer a factor. |
I'm gonna agree with mizunojoe here the only way to avoid c.f. is to move in a straight line effort which is possible with a right arm thrust the left arm being essentially useless it is simply a frozen bent right wrist floating from the top I love how a lot of u (u know who u are) want to quote the books physics and then at the same time you call homer wrong and claim u have all the latest scientific research to back it up.. . Figures just like all the pros out there who used Kellley's information and principles to make money and then go and discredit him after his death, classy...
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I have been thinking about releases and started to wonder on a couple of things. I can swing, with either hand or both. That is a swinging procedure. BUT I can not hit with either hand by itself. The left must be there to checkrein the thrusting right hand. and complete a primary lever assembly. There are 2 pressure points in operation at the same time- #1 thrusting the primary lever assembly and an ACTIVE #3 which also keeps the secondary assembly "moving right along" There are all manner of options. For any stroke length, the #1 thrust can be increased or decreased- #3 pressure should follow. For any #1 thrust, the stroke length can be adjusted. #3 should follow and be constant. But, there can be an background amount of cf and it can come from a pulling, can be generated from the pivot and is realy #4 accumulator. It is background and care must be taken not to damage the work of either #1 thrust or #3 activity. Like to hear your thoughts on this Daryl HB |
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I have a lot of swing to my hitting procedure. Lynn and Ted taught me the procedure . Starting with a lagging takeaway a rotated pressure point and drag loading. Just like they do it. That said even classic drive loading drives th primary lever and there is cf. it's just not employed in release to throw out. |
The right forearm is always driving but it is active or being driven by the swinging left arm
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I think of the primary lever as being like a swinging door . You push it closed with right arm thrust but it swings closed. With cf . The. Cf is in the door not the thrusting device.
In hitting we thrust the entire primary lever. But don't employ cf to initiate release of 2 or 3 . We use the muscular drive out of a right arm throw. The nature of the throw , the linear nature that is, changes with the location of bright elbow . Push vs punch vs pitch. Pitch and hiting perhaps being dangerously to active right arm pulling swinging. |
Great clarification, OB.
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[quote=O.B.Left;93261I have a lot of swing to my hitting procedure. Lynn and Ted taught me the procedure . Starting with a lagging takeaway a rotated pressure point and drag loading. Just like they do it.
That said even classic drive loading drives th primary lever and there is cf. it's just not employed in release to throw out.[/QUOTE] OB. ================================================== ====== OB, I will drag it back to your comment Some times good stuff just goes over everones head. Your loading make a lot of sense. I will not attempt to restate it here but it does conjure up an image: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wguFY...eature=related maybe even a practical one if U watch this video hb |
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Hitters stay "ahead of the Throwout". If the "Throwout" gets ahead, I would consider that to be unintentional. |
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============== :super: --------- :hello: -- |
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hb |
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Think that through, use a club, and try again. Be a sport and upload the video of it. :happy3: |
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That is a nice swing for any age. Hope I can still move like that when I'm 60+ years old. Bumpy |
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1y2fH0ooCoQ |
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Bumpy |
here we go again.
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Here's the rest of it. Quote:
I am in complete agreement in that you must Load the Lag Pressure Point that you will employ in the Throw. Absolutely. Don't mix em up and compensate on the way down. And that the physics of the throw out action changes with the location of the lag pressure point. Of which there is a range of about 90 degrees on the handle top to aft, or depending on what part of the right forefinger attaches , from under the first knuckle at the base of the right index finger to the first joint on the forefinger. (rotated to non rotated lag pressure point). Drag Loading classically employs the Rotated Lag Pressure Point which goes best with a Wrist Throw, Sequenced Release. Drive classically , the first joint on the index finger (non rotated) Lag Pressure Point which goes best with a Right ARm Throw , Simu Release, thrust agains the #1pp on the aft of the shaft. But should the Right Elbow for the Hitter becomes more Pitchy (move closer to the other side of the door as the arm motion becomes more like a throwing motion rather than an inline push) the location of the Lag Pressure Point changes as does the physics of his Release. The Hitter who loads the Rotated Lag Pressure Point during Drag Loading needs to rotate it back prior to Release assuming he's going to thrust against the #1 on the aft of the shaft. Homer didn't like this method but it exists in the wild and on TV. As such you will see most TGM instructors stick to Drive Loading vs Drag Loading , Hitting vs Swinging in their videos . But there is Drag Loading Hitting believe me. Think of 12-1 and 12-2 as starting places , maybe places to stay even . But places with unique identities . Best to start there , master them before moving on. And so Drive is associated with Hitting . An extreme along the spectrum . But it doesn't define Hitting!!!!!! |
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Bumpy |
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