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Hands go back hips go forward

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Old 05-17-2006, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by ThinkingPlus
Isn't that essentially what occurs if one float loads? The hips bump left and clear a little while the right forearm brings the club to top / end on plane. Then everything starts down loading the shaft.
Could be but looks like most of the tour guys have this going on? Lower body going forward as hands are still moving back.
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Old 05-17-2006, 01:50 PM
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Extra Lag
Originally Posted by 12 piece bucket
Could be but looks like most of the tour guys have this going on? Lower body going forward as hands are still moving back.
It is a method for generating extra lag so it would not surprise me to see many of the tour players using this technique, especially those of smaller stature or strength. I do it too, but I am a distance pig (oink, oink).
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Old 05-17-2006, 03:12 PM
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Nicklaus
I remember George Kelnhofer(G.S.E.D.) talking about this one time. He said that some photographers asked Nicklaus to stop at the Top and pose, so they coud take a picture there. He said, "I can't." They asked why, Palmer, and the rest of the guys did it? He said something like..."They may have thought they did it, but, my last move up, is the same as my first move down."

I think he was trying to describe this "transitional" phase of the swing. It seems to be more obvious with the Float Loaders, but you can see something similar in players like Hogan, and Gary Player. David Lee(Gravity Golf), called this 2:1 timing, where the weight moves over and back, before the backswing is finished.

For Swingers... this is part of the #4 Accumulator loading.
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Old 05-17-2006, 08:10 PM
powerdraw powerdraw is offline
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Lagster, could you describe in further detail the 'over and back'?
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Old 05-17-2006, 11:09 PM
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Over And Back
Originally Posted by powerdraw
Lagster, could you describe in further detail the 'over and back'?
...............................

David Lee calls this 2:1 Timing. Not everyone does it quite this way, but with the ones that do... the WEIGHT moves from the LEFT FOOT to the RIGHT FOOT, and back to the LEFT FOOT, before the HANDS, ARMS, AND UPPER TRUNK have finished their motion on the BACKSWING. This sets up what he calls... A "ROTARY WHIP-SLING, on the DOWNSWING. The LEFT HIP is now able to turn and "sling" the arms.

In TGMese... it is a procedure for LOADING the left FOOT, and setting up PIVOT LAG.
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Old 05-18-2006, 07:38 AM
powerdraw powerdraw is offline
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thank you Lagster, it sounds like emphasis on a pivot controlled motion, but i would guess it is training of the pivot component.
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Old 05-18-2006, 09:37 AM
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Pivot vs. Hand
Originally Posted by powerdraw
thank you Lagster, it sounds like emphasis on a pivot controlled motion, but i would guess it is training of the pivot component.
///////////////////////////////////////////////

Yes, this is a procedure where the HANDS just hold, but they have to be EDUCATED.
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Old 05-18-2006, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by lagster
...............................

David Lee calls this 2:1 Timing. Not everyone does it quite this way, but with the ones that do... the WEIGHT moves from the LEFT FOOT to the RIGHT FOOT, and back to the LEFT FOOT, before the HANDS, ARMS, AND UPPER TRUNK have finished their motion on the BACKSWING. This sets up what he calls... A "ROTARY WHIP-SLING, on the DOWNSWING. The LEFT HIP is now able to turn and "sling" the arms.

In TGMese... it is a procedure for LOADING the left FOOT, and setting up PIVOT LAG.
Is this the same "Lee" (I forget the first name) who describes the "Gravity Golf" technique? If so, he describes a "counterfall" -- caused by a controlled unbalance at the End. I think the motion that 12 Piece Bucket was describing is best explained in chapter 4 of SLAP (Swing Like A Pro) called therein the "transition". It shows that in the interval from the position in the backswing where the arms are parallel to the ground and the shaft vertical, to the end, during that same interval, some of the player's weight is shifting to the left. Someone (Jack?) called it the "two-way stretch".

From SLAP "The challenge of learning to uncoil your lower body while the upper body is still rotating to the top of the backswing is an awesome one to most golfers. The concept of moving segments of your body in different directions simultaneously is difficult to grasp, let alone perform ..."

Alan
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Old 05-18-2006, 09:09 PM
EdZ EdZ is offline
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Originally Posted by lagster
I remember George Kelnhofer(G.S.E.D.) talking about this one time. He said that some photographers asked Nicklaus to stop at the Top and pose, so they coud take a picture there. He said, "I can't." They asked why, Palmer, and the rest of the guys did it? He said something like..."They may have thought they did it, but, my last move up, is the same as my first move down."

I think he was trying to describe this "transitional" phase of the swing. It seems to be more obvious with the Float Loaders, but you can see something similar in players like Hogan, and Gary Player. David Lee(Gravity Golf), called this 2:1 timing, where the weight moves over and back, before the backswing is finished.

For Swingers... this is part of the #4 Accumulator loading.
Reminds me of Mike Austin's quote "I keep my head steady and I swing my hips. Like a pendulum."

Basically the essence of a snap release via serious float loading, such that you load and unload at very nearly the same time (cracking the whip at your aiming point). It can be helpful to user mid-body hands at address if using this approach, especially as a swinger.

It almost 'feels' like the grip end is starting to unload as the shaft and clubhead are still loading, just like a cracking whip.
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Old 05-18-2006, 10:45 PM
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Originally Posted by EdZ
Reminds me of Mike Austin's quote "I keep my head steady and I swing my hips. Like a pendulum."

Basically the essence of a snap release via serious float loading, such that you load and unload at very nearly the same time (cracking the whip at your aiming point). It can be helpful to user mid-body hands at address if using this approach, especially as a swinger.

It almost 'feels' like the grip end is starting to unload as the shaft and clubhead are still loading, just like a cracking whip.
///////////////////////////////////////////////

Mr. Lee calls this a "GRAVITY ASSISTED ROTARY WHIP-SLING."
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