My take on it as well. I look at it this way. A lot of us have a basic idae how a car engine works, but would you really attempt serious engine work without a workshop manual that gives you all the specs, tolerances,unique language,terms and procedures? Unless you are a very experienced mechanic, probably not, and even then, you likely have a shop manual for reference. Would a shop manual be useful to a novice who barely knows how to check the oil? Probably not. Homer Kelly authored a workshop manual for the golf swing. Lynn and Ted are very experienced in the contents, and probably only use it periodically like the very esperience auto mechanic. As a tool for the novice golfer, it holds about the same value as the shop manual does for the neophyte auto mechanic.
My $.02
G2M
The only problem with not having somebody competitent is INCOMPLETE instruction through faulty translation . . . In efforts to keep things simple stuff gets omitted that is very critical to the whole . . .
BUT that being said . . . I guarantee that dude that played the senior tour that lived on a farm and played with clubs that got burnt up in a fire got it via INSTINCT.
There certainly are different ways to LEARN it . . . however . . . there has to be an OPTIMUM/more efficient way . . .
Mr. K of course almost MANDATED the use of an AI. And I'm sure there are some of them that "ain't got it."
There certainly are different ways to LEARN it . . . however . . . there has to be an OPTIMUM/more efficient way . . .
The optimum, most efficient way for one student to learn is a waste of time for another. As an example, instructor Chuck Cook has said that he had to invent drills that would keep Payne Stewart engaged because Payne was ADD. Making 100 putts in a row from 3 feet probably wouldn't be a good drill for Payne. Apparently, Tiger loves it. Neither way is right or wrong -- depends on the student.
I would say that the best instructors are those that not only can figure out what swing pattern and techniques best fit an individual student, but also have the ability to teach it in a way that is meaningful for the student.
That's one thing I have never done well....ORGANIZED practice...
I get into random experimentation....
I mean, I practice as much as anyone prolly.....my backyard's about 70 yards long......(with power lines and then bush behind it....I pick a tree, hit balls at it then try to find em)...
Everytime I walk into my garage I end up pickig up my wedge...then end up going into the backyard....usually for about an hour sometimes more.
Not very organized tho....more manic really.....but it's pretty narrowed down now and I have learned a lot. (and dabbled in everything)
I took up golf at a late age, approached it intelligently because I wanted to get as good as I could as quickly as I could.
I was surprised to find how many "opinions" there were about the golf swing from instructors that wanted me to swing like them, and instruction articles that tried to explain how the pros did it. Most of the opinions conflicted with one another. Learning how to swing the club was as frustrating as playing to a high handicap.
The Golfing Machine enabled a clear understanding of the why and how. Plus it gives plenty of options to custom fit. There isn't a single way for me to swing, there is only MY way to swing and it only fits me, like a well tailored suit.
Homer wrote the book with Instructors in mind, but he didn't exclude guys like me that want ownership of their swing.
__________________
Bagger
1-H "Because of questions of all kinds, reams of additional detail must be made available - but separately, and probably endlessly." Homer Kelly
I took up golf at a late age, approached it intelligently because I wanted to get as good as I could as quickly as I could.
I was surprised to find how many "opinions" there were about the golf swing from instructors that wanted me to swing like them, and instruction articles that tried to explain how the pros did it. Most of the opinions conflicted with one another. Learning how to swing the club was as frustrating as playing to a high handicap.
The Golfing Machine enabled a clear understanding of the why and how. Plus it gives plenty of options to custom fit. There isn't a single way for me to swing, there is only MY way to swing and it only fits me like a well tailored suit.
Homer wrote the book with Instructors in mind, but he didn't exclude guys like me that want ownership of their swing.
Bagger,
In the spirit of Bucket's question about how best to learn the information contained in The Golfing Machine, how much of your swing did you learn exclusively from your study of the book before you started getting lessons and explanations from Ben and Lynn.
I'll give my answer. None. I tried many different times to "get into" the book, but my eyes just glazed over. I don't think it's because I'm stupid. Everything I know about how to actually DO the things in the book came from personal lessons with Chuck Evans, Lynn Blake, Ted Fort (just a few minutes with Ted)and Brian Manzella (I also have the Chuck Evans, Greg McHatton, Chuck Cook and Brian Manzella DVD's).
In the spirit of Bucket's question about how best to learn the information contained in The Golfing Machine, how much of your swing did you learn exclusively from your study of the book before you started getting lessons and explanations from Ben and Lynn.
RWH,
The way the book is written, I don't think it can be fully understood without help. These forums are invaluable for armchair work and I'm privileged to do what I do here. I bought the book two years after picking up my first set of clubs. I have always had the supplemental resource of a TGM forum to fall back on. I learned about The Golfing Machine from the very first forum that Chuck Evans started (ezboard) and later the TGM home office forum (both now closed). That was 6 years ago.
For three years, the TGM forum and Chucks forum were all I had to help decipher the book. Without them I wouldn't have made much progress. My scoring dropped from the high-90's to mid-80's during that period and golf became much more enjoyable. But I was stuck and couldn't seem to ever break 80. Ben Doyle was the first AI I spent time with. I would have continued with Ben, but Lynn and I were just beginning to develop a friendship at that time, so I visited him 9 months after seeing Ben.
I went to Lynn with a decent swing, and he corrected many alignment errors I simply couldn't see. It wasn't an overhaul but I had some very common faults. Inside takeaway, misaligned flying wedges at the top, and steering were the biggies. We also worked on short game. I still have it all on video. I've had hands-on lessons with Ben once, twice with Lynn, and once with Steve Ferguson. The second time I saw Lynn was when I met you and we had a memorable dinner at the Atlanta CC.
I'm shooting in the 70's now. Anything over 79 is a bad day. I play a couple times a month and practice when I can. If I could get out more I know I could go low. I've got to get my priorities straight!!! So for a middle aged guy that took up the game late in life and has been golfing 8 years, I'm very happy with my decision to base everything swing related on TGM.
Book reading in combination with the forums helped shave a ton of strokes off my game, and hands-on instruction is making me a player. If the book were my only resource from the beginning, it would probably be gathering dust and so would my swing.
__________________
Bagger
1-H "Because of questions of all kinds, reams of additional detail must be made available - but separately, and probably endlessly." Homer Kelly
Very interesting Bagger. Can't believe you only get to play twice a month. I have to agree The Golfing Machine is the best there is. I have dropped handicap from 8 to 5 since working on the principles this year with the help of Ian Clark and Rob Noel.
The way the book is written, I don't think it can be fully understood without help.
For three years, the TGM forum and Chucks forum were all I had to help decipher the book. Without them I wouldn't have made much progress.
Thanks for sharing. I think This is the True Essence of learning TGM. You need to visit someone who knows and believe TGM to understand TGM. Its Contagious.
Reading and Quoting from the book is easy. But I never understood until Comdpa Demonstrate through visual, feel.
And there is no way that you know exactly your own fault , nomatter how obvious without a coach to tell you, Force you to do something with total faith
__________________
God :God is love.
Latest incubator: Finally appreciate why Hogan wrote 19 pages on GRIP. I bet he could write another 40 pages.
I'm shooting in the 70's now. Anything over 79 is a bad day. I play a couple times a month and practice when I can. If I could get out more I know I could go low. I've got to get my priorities straight!!! So for a middle aged guy that took up the game late in life and has been golfing 8 years, I'm very happy with my decision to base everything swing related on TGM.
I wonder how many other books/authors could say the same-8yrs experience and shooting 80 on a bad day? Full credit to the AIs of course.
Hybrid Mode
