I had to come back as I read we attacked somebody and left them for dead. Can't find any bodies and don't see anybody hurt... Oh well, I'm sure CSI will be here soon...
Kevin
__________________
I could be wrong. I have been before, and will be again.
Still don't see where HK explained the need to alter setup based on the low point and true path. Nor do I see where it is explained about higher lofts creating less angle to the spin axis.
I think Lynn is right though that HK probably would have embraced the D-Plane. He just didn't think of it at the time and it seems he accounted for the fact that there would be more technology and more interpretations that make for clearer descriptions.
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The 4 Jobs in golf
1. Environment - Gets in the way
2. Ball - Interacts with the environment
3. Club - Moves the ball in a specific way
4. Golfer - Swings the club I already paid good money for the first 3...
I think Lynn is right though that HK probably would have embraced the D-Plane. He just didn't think of it at the time and it seems he accounted for the fact that there would be more technology and more interpretations that make for clearer descriptions.
Maybe lucky for us. I think Homer Kelley would have had so much fun playing with the new technology he wouldn't have taken the time to write the book. The proverbial kid in the candy store.
Kevin
__________________
I could be wrong. I have been before, and will be again.
Still don't see where HK explained the need to alter setup based on the low point and true path. Nor do I see where it is explained about higher lofts creating less angle to the spin axis.
I think Lynn is right though that HK probably would have embraced the D-Plane. He just didn't think of it at the time and it seems he accounted for the fact that there would be more technology and more interpretations that make for clearer descriptions.
Low Point is not defined by the Distance between the Clubhead and Left Shoulder or any other part of your Body. If that were the case, then Low Point would be at Full Extension when Both Arms are straight and the Left Wrist is fully Uncocked. For an On-Plane Swing and Level Left Wrist at Impact, without Bobbing or Swaying, the Point at which the Clubhead begins leaving the ground will always be about opposite your Left Shoulder. Hence - "Low Point".
Higher lofted clubs produce less side spin because the Downward line of compression is greater than the sideways line of Compression. Read 2-A.
What would Homer think about the "D-Plane". In "Public" he would have said "oh, that silly thing". Then in "Private", he would have laughed his ass off. I give him credit for having an honest sense of humor.
My, look at that Ball Rolling up the Face of the Clubhead in Frame 2. Does anyone believe that the Ball "Rolling up the Face" of an inclined striker accounts for all of the Spin creating Force on a Golf Ball? No, I didn't think so. Only Jorgensen thought so, and he's a Physicist.
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2-A .....Roll of the ball on the face of an inclined striker does not account for all the action produced by such an impact, especially in imparting spin to the ball.
Low Point is not defined by the Distance between the Clubhead and Left Shoulder or any other part of your Body. If that were the case, then Low Point would be at Full Extension when Both Arms are straight and the Left Wrist is fully Uncocked. For an On-Plane Swing and Level Left Wrist at Impact, without Bobbing or Swaying, the Point at which the Clubhead begins leaving the ground will always be about opposite your Left Shoulder. Hence - "Low Point".
Who precisely are you arguing with here because I NEVER defined where low point was. But if you were to ask me I'd say it's wherever the lowest point is that the clubhead reaches along the arc. Seems to me you can still be pulling the club upward before full extension happens.
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Higher lofted clubs produce less side spin because the Downward line of compression is greater than the sideways line of Compression. Read 2-A.
But D-Plane offers a DIFFERENT explination. Simply that the axis of the spin rotation will be flatter since the loft angles the tragectory more upwards. D-plane deals with this in geometrical terms that accurately describe what we see.
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What would Homer think about the "D-Plane". In "Public" he would have said "oh, that silly thing". Then in "Private", he would have laughed his ass off. I give him credit for having an honest sense of humor.
You sure seem to like putting words in his mouth. Again, I like Lynn's response better. He would have probably expanded on the D-Plan had he known about it instead of pooh poohing it just cause it wasn't his. That is unless you think HK was a real arrogant SOB.
__________________
The 4 Jobs in golf
1. Environment - Gets in the way
2. Ball - Interacts with the environment
3. Club - Moves the ball in a specific way
4. Golfer - Swings the club I already paid good money for the first 3...
You sure seem to like putting words in his mouth. Again, I like Lynn's response better. He would have probably expanded on the D-Plan had he known about it instead of pooh poohing it just cause it wasn't his. That is unless you think HK was a real arrogant SOB.
Then you're naive. When HK examined "In Search of the Perfect Swing", and corrected their many errors, it didn't stop them from publishing the book as written and HK certainly didn't update the Golfing Machine because he found new knowledge. He didn't find new knowledge and I doubt he would find any in "The Physics of Golf" that would cause him to challenge or change his thinking. I mean, if I'm not impressed, what ever would make you think that Homer Kelley would be? I would be much more easily impressed than Homer Kelley.
I wonder what happened to the Hundreds of Golf books in Homer Kelley's library?
You have the opportunity to read both "The Golfing Machine" and "The Physics of Golf" as I have many times. No one on this website or any other has taught me about the "D Plane". I learned by making the effort to buy the book, read it and understand it. The same goes for 2-A and 2-B in the Golfing Machine. They're not exactly the Hot Topics on LBG.com or any other Website for that matter.
This isn't about TGM vs. D-Plane. This is about being spoon-fed the "talking points" without doing the homework yourself. TGM'ers are always accused of putting "Belief" before "Fact". This may be true for many TGM followers at least until they understand the material. Don't be so naive to think that the "D-Plane" is any different.
I spent some time writing my post comparing TGM and the "D-Plane". I used direct information and diagrams from both books to substantiate my claims. You should do the same. I have yet to see, a single, solitary reference to any material published in "The Physics of Golf". All I hear is commentary and TGM bashing.
If you don't understand the material, then fine, this is the place to learn. But if all you want is an excuse not to have to work very hard and long to understand the Golfing Machine, without saying as much, by replacing it with oversimplified science for much less effort, then get in line with 99% of the Golfing world at the back of the bus.
But if its "Sweet Talk" you want, then "I'm sure Homer Kelley would find "The Physics of Golf" interesting and challenging and he and Theodore would probably have become great friends and work together on many projects."
Let me simplify what I'm trying to say. Jorgensen "discovered" that about 85% of the initial direction of a struck Golf Ball is directly related to the direction the Clubface is pointing. He didn't invent, he discovered. So did Homer Kelley. Jorgenson also discovered that a Tilted Spin Axis will cause the Ball to curve one way or another. So did Homer Kelley. Jorgensen discovered that the amount of divergence of Clubface Alignment and Clubhead Path caused the Spin Axis to tilt in a predictable way. So did Homer Kelley. Jorgensen "Coined" this phenomena the "D-Plane". Homer Kelley called the Phenomena a Fade, Draw, Pull, Push, Pull Hook, Hook, Slice, etc., you get my meaning. But, there's much more to it than that. You'll find all the answers in The Golfing Machine.
Hybrid Mode
