Hogan Right Shoulder Motion Elbow Plane Hitter

[Daryl]

Sure why not . . . . make your case for Swinging . . .

I don't want to argue the point and It doesn't bother me if he Hit-Swung-Swat-Swit or nibbled on the ball, but are you using the glossary definitions included in the 6th Edition?

HITTING AND SWINGING Example – the catapult vs. the sling.
Mechanical – Continuous thrust producing steady acceleration of a hinged beam is Hitting action. A rotating arm pulling steadily on a weighted line is a swinging action.
Golf – Accelerating the Club radially with Right Arm Thrust is Hitting. Accelerating the Club longitudinally, with either arm is Swinging.

Maybe Hogan was a Switter?

[BerntR]

So the relationship between Right Shoulder and Hands (or Left ARm) will always get more divergent after Startdown, particularly for those that are in the process of shifting to a lower plane.

Thanks for a great post O.B.Left. The part I'm quoting interests me a lot. I think you touch upon something essential to understand Hogan's stroke and also something that's fundamental to golf in general. At least for those who impact the ball on a lower than TSP plane. There's something about that geometry - where a flat shoulder turn drives the hands down - that just spells sustained lag pressure to me.

[gmbtempe]

Thanks . . . . but can't take credit for this idea . . . Eddie Cox has been talking about this for awhile now . . . I just never really "got it." . . . feeling . . . connect the right shoulder to the "pocket" above the left elbow joint . . . seems to pressure the lever assembly down

This is part of the basis of my current instruction, the right shoulder motions, and this obviously affects the left shoulder. There is also an issue of their location from the face on.

Nice photo's!

[BerntR]

I would like to see some vectors that basically ignored the right elbow. Vectors that goes straigth from the right shoulder and points to whatever it is pushing. I'm not sure whether it's pushing the hands, the clubhead or a MOI center somewhere between the two. But I am CERTAIN that something very important is happening between the shoulder and the club - and where the right elbow is just a connection without a geometrical purpose on its own.

[12 piece bucket]

I don't want to argue the point and It doesn't bother me if he Hit-Swung-Swat-Swit or nibbled on the ball, but are you using the glossary definitions included in the 6th Edition?



Maybe Hogan was a Switter?

Not for argument purposes . . . I'm actually not sure about it at this point . . . I just see some distinctly different shoulder motion from Hogan than others . . . HOw about this . .

Can you give us definitions and examples (pics maybe) of Flywheel motion vs. Backstop/Launching Pad?

Gotta get ready to burst out to work . . . but I'll chime in too.

[david sandridge]

Ok bucket are you saying the right shoulder follows the left elbow pocket or does it drive it. I guess swinging you could follow it or in hitting you could drive it. How does this relate to the "mind in the hands". Perhaps this type of swing thought could prevent the OTT move or the underplane problem. I anxiously await further flywheel and platform explanations. Once I've gottem then pray for a break in the temp so I can go to the range. Sorry you have to work bucket. I am going to sit by the fire all day like most old folks.

[Daryl]

................Can you give us definitions and examples (pics maybe) of Flywheel motion vs. Backstop/Launching Pad?..................

#1 Spin the Flywheel / Longitudinal Acceleration / Slap: Swinger

#2 Switter / Longitudinal Acceleration / Punch: Launching Pad on the Fly, Right Forearm Flying Wedge Aligned to Horizontal Hinge Paddlewheel Motion with Right Arm Punch-Thrust. Angled Hinge Action.

#3 Backstop/Launching Pad / Radial Acceleration / Punch: Hitter

Any of these Procedures can become greatness on the Golf Course. It's up to the Player.

[12 piece bucket]

Ok bucket are you saying the right shoulder follows the left elbow pocket or does it drive it. I guess swinging you could follow it or in hitting you could drive it. How does this relate to the "mind in the hands". Perhaps this type of swing thought could prevent the OTT move or the underplane problem. I anxiously await further flywheel and platform explanations. Once I've gottem then pray for a break in the temp so I can go to the range. Sorry you have to work bucket. I am going to sit by the fire all day like most old folks.

I'd say "drives" and "supports" in terms of motion and geometry . . . right shoulder is part of the power package right? . . . Also this whole deal with the right shoulder supporting/driving or whatever we wanna call it the left arm is very much in line with Hogan's pane of glass . . . the pane of glass was NOT the swing plane . . . it was the hands being UNDERNEATH the pane which is THE PLANE THE SHOULDERS TURN ON . . . your hands were to be UNDER THE PANE (SHOULDERS) never BUST THROUGH . . . Shoulders ON TOP . . .

[12 piece bucket]

#1 Spin the Flywheel: Swinger

#2 Combination: Launching Pad on the Fly, Right Forearm Flying Wedge Aligned to Horizontal Hinge Paddlewheel Motion with Right Arm Thrust causing Angled Hinge Action preventing the Full Roll of Horizontal Hinging.

#3 Backstop/Launching Pad: Hitter

Who's doing what here? Who's "overriding" Centrifugal force?

LAG AND THRUST

6-C-0 GENERAL
Pivot Lag (9-1) is Body Power for Swingers (2-M-4), launching pad for Hitters (2-M-3), and for both, operates like a “gear train” to extend the Swing Radius of the Primary Lever to any point from the Shoulder Turn on down to the Feet (Zone #1). Both Inertia and the Moment Arm of the Thrust act as the same in that the farther from the center the greater the authority.

Accumulator Lag (7-19) and/or Thrust (7-11) determine the amount of Power generated by the Power Package – Zone #2 (9-2).

Clubhead Lag (7-19) promotes even and steady acceleration, assuring dependable control of distance. The Power Package utilizes four types of Thrust:
1. Accerlerating (Accumulators driving the Leverl Assemblies)
2. Non-Accelerating (Extensor Action supplying Power Package Mass)
3. Acceleration Control (Lag Pressure Point sensing Clubhead Inertia)
4. “Centrifugal Acceleration” (Centrifugal Force pulling the Clubhead toward its In- Line condition)

[KevCarter]

A picture I found of Hogan late in life. I think a very good case can be made that the right shoulder is still in line to drive the main lever of the power package here at P5.



Steve Stricker working on similar alignments at top?