Plane

[bts]

Let us discuss the possible reasons for getting the CLUB OFF-PLANE on the BACKSWING and DOWNSWING, and the best ways to STAY ON-PLANE. I'll start with a couple, then others chime in.

Off-Plane

1. Right Forearm off-plane at Address. I realize that many(most) do set up with the forearm off-plane, but this is one possibility.

2. Changing the BENT RIGHT WRIST angle. This should not change at all throughout the Stroke, except briefly in the front part, between Follow-Through and Finish, when the arms MIRROR the BACKSTROKE conditions.

"getting the CLUB OFF-PLANE": More dominant action of the hands/arms than shoulder turn. Why? Because the range of movement (degree of freedom) for the former is a lot more than the latter.

"the best ways to STAY ON-PLANE": Spin around an axis.

[lagster]

A lot of good input and information here!!

OK... let's get more specific. Mr. Hoch, for example, in the pictures posted by Annikan, has the butt of his club pointing well inside the baseline. This would be Off-plane according to many. He, however, is an excellent ball striker. Is this an example of a correct variation, for someone on his very STEEP Backswing Plane?

[EdZ]

A lot of good input and information here!!

OK... let's get more specific. Mr. Hoch, for example, in the pictures posted by Annikan, has the butt of his club pointing well inside the baseline. This would be Off-plane according to many. He, however, is an excellent ball striker. Is this an example of a correct variation, for someone on his very STEEP Backswing Plane?

Not off plane in my view - just a very steep plane - and a very steep path\plane of his hands motion (the path of the pressure points in 3 dimensinonal space).

You have to watch what the hands/pressure points do. The plane is defined by the hands (pressure points) and the sweet spot - not the shaft - and unless you have zeroed out #3 - far better to just watch the path of the hands for 'the' plane.

[lagster]

How do you think the PIVOT COMPONENTS(HIP TURN, KNEES, SHOULDER TURN, etc.) affect the BACKSWING PLANE?

[annikan skywalker]

Thee range of motion, speed, style and sequencing greatly affect plane angle...especially for a "Pivot-Controlled Procedure"...However a true "Hand Controllled procedure the Pivot Components are a reponse to the intentions of the Hands and the Eyes...

[DOCW3]

Not off plane in my view - just a very steep plane - and a very steep path\plane of his hands motion (the path of the pressure points in 3 dimensinonal space).

You have to watch what the hands/pressure points do. The plane is defined by the hands (pressure points) and the sweet spot - not the shaft - and unless you have zeroed out #3 - far better to just watch the path of the hands for 'the' plane.

I am really not clear on what we are looking for in these photos and if it is the samenesses or the differences that are significant. The biggest question being where the sweet spot should be and the adequacy of the camera angle. Hoch sure looks different in this set, giving Tiger some slack and not knowing where BC's ball is. I would want to see Hoch at the top.

I tend to agree that one needs to watch the hands, but to see if one is on plane or shifting and not to define the plane. HK did not define a plane angle with the lag pressure point. He did say that both the sweet spot plane and the shaft plane pass through the lag pressure point. OTOH, the path the hands take in both directions does seem to be significant in the stroke concepts of some if not many tour players.

DRW