I think this may have an effect on holding body positions (or centers). For players that I have seen with a very acute #2 angle, the head seems to dip down and back through impact... almost to back out of it to release the angles.
I think you can have too much Slicer. I'm not sure you can have too much #2, but you can sure start releasing it too late and maintain it too long.
One example that comes to mind would be #1. You don't want to take that past 90° or you lose the ability to employ extensor action. That may be a separate issue?
Kevin
__________________
I could be wrong. I have been before, and will be again.
I'm thinking more of the player who floats is at the top and from face on there is very little space between the shaft and the shoulder.
The player needs great hands to get it back from there, like Sergio. I would certainly be careful with a student that he can recover from a lot of accumulator lag. I think I remember someone saying that Sergio type lag is great for distance, not so great for accuracy, but Sergio is a wonderful driver of the ball... so, it must depend... I believe these "snap" type release procedures to be geared more towards very accomplished players.
Kevin
__________________
I could be wrong. I have been before, and will be again.
Yes sorry Slice, I took you in a direction that you didnt need to go. The Lag and Drag of the Pivot Train 6-M-1 is a different consideration than that of power generation from the Accumulators. See 6-B for more on that. The Pivot Trains release of Lag is associated with a loss of power and therefor has no Release Point. Sort of like pp#3 in that way. The Accumulators however must be released to generate Power, their Release Point is necessary and of critical importance.
I remember Sean Foley saying that 90 degrees was max for #2 angle. That anything more was counter productive. You must have a student with one heck of a float load. In terms of TGM I can only think of the Endless Belt Analogy and its implications to the Release Point. The later the more power, basically for any given hand speed.
Didnt Ben Doyle say something like "having too much Lag is like having too much Love". I can see how it could be a problem though. Its an interesting question.
OK Ive been thinking about this a little. Couple of things first. Lag in a common golf speak sense is what we TGM types would describe as float loading but with a degrees of left wrist cock perspective attached. Whereas, Like Kev alluded to, Homers Accumulator Lag refers primarily to Lag Pressure at the #3pp which cant be measured visually really, beyond noting the trailing condition of the clubhead. Perhaps if you had a sensor at the #3 measuring the pound per square inch or something.
Accumulator Lag is discussed in 7-19 Lag Loading, where amongst other things Homer says; "Properly manipulated, Clubhead Inertia can withstand all the Lag Pressure anyone can generate."
In terms of degrees of #2, left wrist cock, absent any mechanical arguments against exceeding 90 degrees, Im thinking that you should let the conditions of Release and Impact be your guide. In other words play around with his float loading (Lag Loading) to discover what gets him to his best Release Point. Test it on a launch monitor maybe after you think you got it figured out.
And in this regard Homer does mention degrees of Left Wrist Cock in a way. See 6-N-0, Its a great read but basically the "short quick Arc of Maximum Delay", Snap Release, Maximum Power, is measured in degrees.
"This involves Angular Speed which is measured by the number of degrees of an Arc through which the motion moves per second"
The "per second" part alluding to the Release Point, Travel Time. An earlier Release Point increases the travel time for any given number of degrees to the Arc, with an accompanying loss of power for any given Hand speed. Homer says that doubling the travel time (earlier release) halves the travel rate. To me suggesting that the important thing is not what your guy is doing at Top or in Startdown but what he is doing at Release, so let that be your guide.
Slice, I bet YodasLuke, aka Ted Fort would be the guy to talk on this sort of stuff. Its right in his wheel house.
Lag in a common golf speak sense is what we TGM types would describe as float loading but with a degrees of left wrist cock perspective attached. Lag is the act of trailing. Float loading is one of three methods used as a loading technique - that's separate from the defintion of lag.
Like Kev alluded to, Homers Accumulator Lag refers primarily to Lag Pressure at the #3pp which cant be measured visually really, beyond noting the trailing condition of the clubhead.
Accumulator lag isn't well defined in the golfing machine but I would at least think it is how much the accumulator is out of line - whether it be #1, #2, #3 or #4 i.e. how much the accumulator is trailing an in-line condition. It certainly has it's relationship to lag pressure - but I wouldn't say it primarily refers to Lag Pressure.
6-C Quote: "Accumulator Lag (7-19) and/or Thrust (7-11) determine the amount of Power generated by the Power Package – Zone #2 (9-2)." And from 6-B-0: "Varying the amount of out-of-line and/or the amount of muscular effort will vary the accumulation of Power that can be Released ...."
In terms of degrees of #2, left wrist cock, absent any mechanical arguments against exceeding 90 degrees, Im thinking that you should let the conditions of Release and Impact be your guide. From a level condition- the most "cocking" you can get is 30 degrees. From an anatomical defintion - 20 degrees.
When it's four degrees out! - there's time for some forum posting!
__________________
Life Goal- Developing a new theory of movement based on Brain Science
Interests - Dabbling with insanity
Hobbies- Creating Quality
I think this may have an effect on holding body positions (or centers). For players that I have seen with a very acute #2 angle, the head seems to dip down and back through impact... almost to back out of it to release the angles.
In regard to this tendency, Slice, you could look at it as being a subconscious move of the left shoulder (low point) backwards giving them more time to square it up, release. As if they need more time in the "degrees per second" equation of 6-N-0.
The other ways to increase the time would be to change the Release Point, slow down the hand speed or move the ball forward if its a driver. Or simply decrease the degrees, #2 Angle.
Interesting question. Wish I had that problem.
There can be a similar sort of tendency where guys back out of a driver to achieve a higher launch angle. They move their low point back, dynamically during the swing. For those guys if they want to stay centered, the solution is to move the ball forward in the stance.
Homer wanted a centered pivot of course but he also included the proviso "except for special purposes". I think he's talking launch angle and power maybe. Lynn would know. He did tell me once that the driver can (at times) be considered a specialty club, in that you're trying to get it as far down there as you can, with an accepted loss in accuracy. But this is for another thread maybe. You certainly wouldnt want to back out of an iron shot from the fairway with all the money on the line.
I believe these "snap" type release procedures to be geared more towards very accomplished players.
Hybrid Mode
