Very nice . . . thanks . . . . So question WHEN do you jump from the top? Start down? Impact? And how would you describe the jump? Straight up? To the left? Also . . . . How would you jump AND and keep the proper trajectory of the right shoulder and not get the club moving off plane?
Got any descriptions of the exercises or is that double top secret stuff?
Thanks . . . nice thread going here.
Ummm ... not sure if you're being funny or if I'm completely missing the point!?! You don't jump in a golf swing. I was using what your leg muscles do when you do a standing leap as an example of an SSC. It's not an SSC that you would actually involve in your golf swing!
As I understand it the SSCs that you activate in your golf swing are across the front of your torso and in the back of your left shoulder (and maybe in front of your right shoulder). There may be others that I don't know about (there is a lot that I don't know about!) All of the Short Stretch Cycles happen in the downswing only, as best I understand it. They start from when your centre of mass starts to move back to the left, which I suspect is best to happen before your arms complete their backswing.
So the SSCs themselves. The torso is activated when your hips rotate back to the left (right if you're a lefty). The hips move before the torso/shoulders which creates "separation" and stretches the muscles as they run from your right shoulder to your left hip. In a proper movement pattern your hips would only need to move a few degrees (so a 10 degree movement would see your hips turn one thirty-sixth of the total 360 degree circle). They hips should then stop (this is one of those things that you can never do consciously and so needs to be trained). This would create the separation and stretch. The muscles across your torso would then fire (this is the short stretch cycle in action). They would shorten which causes your torso and shoulders to turn rapidly around your fairly stable spine.
As you can imagine the turning of your shoulders creates another strech in the muscles at the back of your left shoulder. This is because the arm and club will not immediately move at the same speed as the shoulders (in the same way the shoulders did not immediately move at the same time at the hips). If you think about it this is a process of creating and releasing lag. Lag between the hips and shoulders. Then lag between the shoulder and arms. Then lag between the arms and clubshaft. This is good TGM!
So now we have a stretch at the back of the left shoulder. Proper biomechanics mean that these muscles quickly fire in another SSC and accelarate the arm, dragging the club along for the ride.
The final piece is when the hands stop around the bottom of their arc. This releases the clubshaft and all that lovely built up lag into the back of the ball, sending it flying long and straight down the fairway. Beautiful!
The reengagement of your hips and momentum will then pull your whole body around to the finish.
I could describe the exercises I do but Bio has advised me against it. The thing is that there are exercises to help you if your hips turn too far without stopping. And there are exercises to help you if your hips don't turn enough before stopping. I don't know exactly what mine do! And without screening you cannot know what exercises you need. You get a personally developed program - I know because I am referred to in the video I got by name!
So now we have a stretch at the back of the left shoulder. Proper biomechanics mean that these muscles quickly fire in another SSC and accelarate the arm, dragging the club along for the ride.
The final piece is when the hands stop around the bottom of their arc. This releases the clubshaft and all that lovely built up lag into the back of the ball, sending it flying long and straight down the fairway. Beautiful!
The reengagement of your hips and momentum will then pull your whole body around to the finish.
If I stop my hands sooner, will the Club have more time to pick up greater speed?
Hey there Weetbix, loving this thread. I've been thorough the screening process myself and have started my PST's. For me this is the way to go. I had been reading up on the mechanics and had lessons but still could not get the idea of putting my swing together. I'd have good days but couldn't work out why the bad ones were so bad. With Bioengine I've learned how the whole thing goes together and have a solid set of PST's that are in a specific order to train my body to perform this kinetic link with no thoughts getting in the way. I'm striking the ball more consistently than ever.
It was quite amazing what I learned about my swing from the screening too and just how out of whack it was, I was making all sorts of compensations that were causing dire shots.
I was skeptical at first but keen enough about golf to try, I certainly made the right choice and highly recommend this process to anyone who wants to play better golf.
your arms decelerating isn't something you physically try and do in the golf swing, If you try to achieve arm deceleration physically you will hit the ball fat.
The arms slow down they don't actually come to a complete stop.
Each body segment accelerates and decelerates. This must occur for the law of conservation to work.The reason for deceleration of each segment is so speed can be transferred to the next body segment.
In order for this to work you effectively you need 6-M-1 (kinetic link) conservation of momentum and Muscular loading.
If you have all these combinations each body segment will accelerate and decelerate and pass speed to next segment.
(This happen naturally) This continues up through your kinetic Link (6-M-1). Hips,upper body,arms,until distal end speed is transferred to the club.
This all happens naturally when you have trained your body how to create conservation of momentum and muscular loading.
These events you can apply physically by going to the practice fairway grinding balls.
Regarding the SSC this is complicated topic to speak about and for people to understand SSC and muscular loading I would need to write a 50 page essay.There's mountains of information you need to learn, to develop an understanding how this works in the golf swing.
Weetbix.
What do you mean by this below????
Absolutely. Sooner the better. Somewhere around you right ear would work best for you I suspect
Not sure what you mean here ???
Last edited by bioengine : 08-07-2009 at 10:50 PM.
I agree with much of this but not that deceleration is needed to transfer momentum to the next acceleration stage.
I feel that my own Pivot supplies all of the Work. I also feel that the work that the Pivot provides is separate but synchronized with the Downstroke Acceleration sequence of my Power Package.
My Pivot components don't slow or stop and are sequenced to provide continuous motion and power to the Swing. My Hips lead and power the Shoulders throughout the Downstroke. My Shoulders trail my hips at least until the Finish Swivel.
Foot, knee and Hip Actions are sequenced. Keep in mind that Foot loading is different for Straight and Circle Delivery Paths. So, the Pivot will look different, sequence differently and provide different work. Foot loading is vastly important. Without sensing and sequencing the Ground pressures through my feet and allowing my feet to increase and decrease these pressures, It's difficult to move the Hips very far and it's not possible for the Hips to drive the shoulders through Impact and beyond. Ground Pressures are very powerful and yet can be very sensitive and delicate around the greens. The Sequence doesn't change but the pressures and spacing and pacing of the components changes to fit the shot at hand. It's almost unconscious.
If there is no deceleration then lag/wrist cock would be sustained until well past the ball, and you wouldn't actually hit it! The arms have to decelerate for the wrist cock to be released surely?? It works the same for the rest of the sequence, hips/shoulders/arms yes? That's how I understand it.
I agree with much of this but not that deceleration is needed to transfer momentum to the next acceleration stage.
I feel that my own Pivot supplies all of the Work. I also feel that the work that the Pivot provides is separate but synchronized with the Downstroke Acceleration sequence of my Power Package.
My Pivot components don't slow or stop and are sequenced to provide continuous motion and power to the Swing. My Hips lead and power the Shoulders throughout the Downstroke. My Shoulders trail my hips at least until the Finish Swivel.
Foot, knee and Hip Actions are sequenced. Keep in mind that Foot loading is different for Straight and Circle Delivery Paths. So, the Pivot will look different, sequence differently and provide different work. Foot loading is vastly important. Without sensing and sequencing the Ground pressures through my feet and allowing my feet to increase and decrease these pressures, It's difficult to move the Hips very far and it's not possible for the Hips to drive the shoulders through Impact and beyond. Ground Pressures are very powerful and yet can be very sensitive and delicate around the greens. The Sequence doesn't change but the pressures and spacing and pacing of the components changes to fit the shot at hand. It's almost unconscious.
All of this was taught to me by Yoda, years ago.
Daryl,
How do you know, unless your have been tested to measures your body speed etc how do you know if they are accelerating and decelerating.
You can't no one can.
Myself I can't even feel these events occurring, the body is moving so fast you can't sense acceleration and deceleration occurring.
Daryl your going on your beliefs here. here's how conservation of momentum work
Formula M1*V1=-M2*V2
example
The above equation is one statement of the law of momentum conservation. In a collision, the momentum change of object 1 is equal to and opposite of the momentum change of object 2. That is, the momentum lost by object 1 is equal to the momentum gained by object 2. In most collisions between two objects, one object slows down and loses momentum while the other object speeds up and gains momentum. If object 1 loses 75 units of momentum, then object 2 gains 75 units of momentum. Yet, the total momentum of the two objects (object 1 plus object 2) is the same before the collision as it is after the collision. The total momentum of the system (the collection of two objects) is conserved.
In golf you need 6-M-1, conservation of momentum and muscular loading which fires each body segment to continue to create velocity(speed) until the distal end speed reaches the club.
Each body segment must accel/decl to transfer speed.
No beliefs or opinions, pure physics and measured science to back the theories.
Daryl, I could understand why your not doing this in your golf swing, if you were accelerating and decelerating each body segment you wouldn't be here you would be out on tour winning.
We all would be out there winning LOL.
As I say to everyday to those who argue, where is there measured science and research to back their beliefs and where is there measured science and research to prove us wrong. And what back ground or understanding do they have in biomechanics and movement patterns. SO they stop and think for minute so they open up their minds to other avneues.
Although the laws of physics all the biomechanists are on the same page, they all agree on newton's laws, conservation of momentum and the kinetic link. This is applied in all bat and ball sport.Not only golf we work with athlete's in many other sports and has tens of thousands athletes data. Years of research involved.
As I said no beliefs or opinions, we have research, measured science and Pure physics.
Last edited by bioengine : 08-08-2009 at 05:18 AM.
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