You do not want the right arm to straighten before impact. This is running out of right arm. Remember- just past Low point- which is just in front of the ball does the right arm fully become straight. A hitter stops at the Top- shoulder high and On Plane. The Pivot Lag Train will prevent over the top and keep the body ahead of the Hands. The correct use of the Right Shoulder is the key.
Thanks!! Thats was a nice contribution to timing my right forearm thrust.
Originally Posted by 6bmike
This is something not usually done by a Hitter.
I understand. I have bveen spending some time with Bobby Clampett's new book and have some nice dividends to show for my efforts. I have acquired some delicious new distance working hard on creating lag, and then sustaining it. I use some of the concepts you suggest as well. Particularly I love the idea of hitting the ball with my pressure points. I am trying hard to get better at feeling the lag in pressure points #1 and #3. I absolutely love using pressure point number 3 in my chipping, and have recently added it to my putting in the hope of developing its potential further. Having made some nice progress with lag creation and back hinging as I start down, I would hate to give those techniques up, unless I am confident that I will end up with something better. So I am testing the different lagging techniques empirically to find out what works best for me. Thanks for the new suggestions in this regard. (One of the things I noticed in watching Hitter's Row video is that Lynn Blake's wrist angles near the top of his back swing, are much more acute than Ted Fort's. I wonder what Lynn does when he hits instead of swings. Does he change to a hitter's lag techniques, or does he use what he already does so well? ) Anyone know?
Something else I really really like from Bobby Clampett is that he believes a golfer should take a divot that continues 4 inches in front of the impact point. That concept has resulted in a significantly improved ball flight for me. It particularly works especially great out of the sand trap. I do a drill in the sand trap where I draw a line in the sand, and then concentrate on hitting the line (the ball) and taking a 4 inch divot had of the line. I guess that means that I am aiming for mole heads significantly in front my impact point instead of just in front of impact. Do you strongly disagree with Bobby Claimpett suggestion?
Particularly I love the idea of hitting the ball with my pressure points. I am trying hard to get better at feeling the lag in pressure points #1 and #3. I absolutely love using pressure point number 3 in my chipping..."
"Mind in the Hands" is a video I made for Lynn- it talks about hitting the ball with the PP of the Hands. PP#3 is the clubhead- be careful not to be too active with it as it will produce "throw-away."
Quote:
One of the things I noticed in watching Hitter's Row video is that Lynn Blake's wrist angles near the top of his back swing, are much more acute than Ted Fort's. I wonder what Lynn does when he hits instead of swings. Does he change to a hitter's lag techniques, or does he use what he already does so well? Anyone know?
Lynn uses Standard Left Wrist Action which in the back swing turns the wrists to the right past Top to the End - a Swinger's prodcedure. This allows the Hands to roll with the the Wrist Throw and Drag Loading to produce CF.
Ted- a Hitter uses Single Left Wrist Action which has no wrist turn and loads to the Top (shoulder Height). This is what Lynn and all Hitters do. The Single Left Wrist Action loads Lag at the Top- shoulder height.
Quote:
Something else I really really like from Bobby Clampett is that he believes a golfer should take a divot that continues 4 inches in front of the impact point. That concept has resulted in a significantly improved ball flight for me. It particularly works especially great out of the sand trap. I do a drill in the sand trap where I draw a line in the sand, and then concentrate on hitting the line (the ball) and taking a 4 inch divot had of the line. I guess that means that I am aiming for mole heads significantly in front my impact point instead of just in front of impact. Do you strongly disagree with Bobby Claimpett suggestion?
I have not read Clampett's book. A divot is produced in front of the ball becasue the ball is located UP PLANE and you are striking DOWN Plane to Low Point that is located just in front of the ball. As long as the Line of Compression is through the ball heading to Low Point- the length of the divot is not important. It would vary from club to club and ball location fro that club.
I would not impact the ball out of the bunker the same way you strike a ball on a fairway.
Ben Doyle has drills in the bunker that teaches the student Lag, Thrust and Impact Alignments because the sand makes for a great visual aid. The drills are not meant to produce bunker shots- just teach. Ben teaches in the bunker all the time but not bunker shots.
Explore the Flying Wedges, take the Hands out of the shot and rely on the Machine's alignments to produce great G.O.L.F. shots
"Mind in the Hands" is a video I made for Lynn- it talks about hitting the ball with the PP of the Hands. PP#3 is the clubhead- be careful not to be too active with it as it will produce "throw-away."
I learned to concentrate on hitting the ball with pressure points in the hands from a video featuring both Lynn and Ben. Is that the one you made? It definitely encouraged me to try and use my pressure points more in my swing.
Originally Posted by 6bmike
This is what Lynn and all Hitters do. The Single Left Wrist Action loads Lag at the Top- shoulder height.
I invested over two weeks working on lagging according the Bobby Claimpett. I got additional distance and better more consistent ball flight. I hate to undo a something that has helped my game. I remember a video suggesting that the right elbow loads the hitters left wrist. But, I can do a lot more loading with Clampett's procedure and I have difficulty unilaterally giving back some of the lag I have been enjoying so much.
I wonder if it would be too much trouble for your to suggest what the advantage to me would be with the lagging method Ted Fort uses as a hitter that compensates for its disadvantage of a lower amount of initial lag loading?
Originally Posted by 6bmike
A divot is produced in front of the ball becasue the ball is located UP PLANE and you are striking DOWN Plane to Low Point that is located just in front of the ball.
I believe Clampett suggests that low point be quite a bit further ahead than just in front of the ball.
Originally Posted by 6bmike
Ben Doyle has drills in the bunker that teaches the student Lag, Thrust and Impact Alignments because the sand makes for a great visual aid. The drills are not meant to produce bunker shots- just teach. Ben teaches in the bunker all the time but not bunker shots.
That is exactly how the drill I was doing worked, which makes sense because Clampett learned from Doyle. I didn't do the drills to improve my sand shots. I did them to teach myself to move my low point further ahead. The strange thing was that after I did the drills, my sand shots improved as an unexpected bonus. Being able to sustain my lag much later, gave me the ability to hit much more powerful sand shots when the pin was a significant distance from bunker.
I invested over two weeks working on lagging according the Bobby Claimpett. I got additional distance and better more consistent ball flight. I hate to undo a something that has helped my game. I remember a video suggesting that the right elbow loads the hitters left wrist. But, I can do a lot more loading with Clampett's procedure and I have difficulty unilaterally giving back some of the lag I have been enjoying so much.
Clampett is not a Hitter- he uses a Swing Stroke Pattern. He would not use Single Left Wrist Action or stop at the Top. He would go to End with Standard Left Wrist Action and use Drag loading to ‘throw’ his wrists- Acc#2 and #3 to create CF. A Pull induced Throw-out.
A Hitter, does not use CF throw-out. A Hitter uses Drive Loading from the Top not the End and pushes the whole club, head and shaft into the ball. A pushing driving Right Arm with muscle power.
I would say if you are following Clampett- you are a Swinger, not a Hitter since you have Swinger components. I never suggested you not do what is working, just be aware that you ain’t a Hitter.
I wonder if it would be too much trouble for your to suggest what the advantage to me would be with the lagging method Ted Fort uses as a hitter that compensates for its disadvantage of a lower amount of initial lag loading?
You are mixing up components. Hitters have No disadvantage with loading Lag. And I think you see Accumulator Lag as the only “Lag.” A Hitter use Pivot Lag to set up a powerful platform to Drive from and uses as much Clubhead Lag as a Swinger. Accumulator Lag is the only Lag that is released. A Swinger drags and releases them sequentially, whereas a Hitter mashes down on the ball releasing them simultaneously.
I believe Clampett suggests that low point be quite a bit further ahead than just in front of the ball.
I can't see how. If you study The Geometry of the Circle, you will see that the Low Point is just in front of the ball- an inch at most. Any further in the Circle becomes an elongated oval which is not what Homer teaches. The whole RFT is to allow the stroke pattern and golfer to have the best ideal swing shape. With the Low point in front of the ball, the ball lies just UP on the incline plane- this allows perfect Line of Compression. If the Low point of the stroke was four inches in front of the ball and still a circle, the ball would have to be on a Tee.
The divot can be four inches but low point would be before the divot ended.
You are a Swinger wink- nothing wrong with that. Drive that elbow deep into the stroke and have fun.
I invested over two weeks working on lagging according the Bobby Claimpett. I got additional distance and better more consistent ball flight. I hate to undo a something that has helped my game. I remember a video suggesting that the right elbow loads the hitters left wrist. But, I can do a lot more loading with Clampett's procedure and I have difficulty unilaterally giving back some of the lag I have been enjoying so much.
Clampett is not a Hitter- he uses a Swing Stroke Pattern. He would not use Single Left Wrist Action or stop at the Top. He would go to End with Standard Left Wrist Action and use Drag loading to ‘throw’ his wrists- Acc#2 and #3 to create CF. A Pull induced Throw-out.
A Hitter, does not use CF throw-out. A Hitter uses Drive Loading from the Top not the End and pushes the whole club, head and shaft into the ball. A pushing driving Right Arm with muscle power.
I would say if you are following Clampett- you are a Swinger, not a Hitter since you have Swinger components. I never suggested you not do what is working, just be aware that you ain’t a Hitter.
I wonder if it would be too much trouble for your to suggest what the advantage to me would be with the lagging method Ted Fort uses as a hitter that compensates for its disadvantage of a lower amount of initial lag loading?
You are mixing up components. Hitters have No disadvantage with loading Lag. And I think you see Accumulator Lag as the only “Lag.” A Hitter use Pivot Lag to set up a powerful platform to Drive from and uses as much Clubhead Lag as a Swinger. Accumulator Lag is the only Lag that is released. A Swinger drags and releases them sequentially, whereas a Hitter mashes down on the ball releasing them simultaneously.
I believe Clampett suggests that low point be quite a bit further ahead than just in front of the ball.
I can't see how. If you study The Geometry of the Circle, you will see that the Low Point is just in front of the ball- an inch at most. Any further in the Circle becomes an elongated oval which is not what Homer teaches. The whole RFT is to allow the stroke pattern and golfer to have the best ideal swing shape. With the Low point in front of the ball, the ball lies just UP on the incline plane- this allows perfect Line of Compression. If the Low point of the stroke was four inches in front of the ball and still a circle, the ball would have to be on a Tee.
The divot can be four inches but low point would be before the divot ended.
You are a Swinger wink- nothing wrong with that. Drive that elbow deep into the stroke and have fun.
6B,
As your very distant cousin "12-Piece" might say.... you have been "on fire" with so many of your posts lately! Keep up the good work... you have developed a "near-Yoda" type grasp of the book!
As your very distant cousin "12-Piece" might say.... you have been "on fire" with so many of your posts lately! Keep up the good work... you have developed a "near-Yoda" type grasp of the book!
CG
Thank You but it is a VERY very distant near. We all know that Lynn is "da man" or is it that he is "da Yoda" of the Yellow Book. Nobody knows it or more importantly, explains it better than LB. Many of us have been lucky to spend time with the green guy and pick his brain.
I alternated shots, back and forth, on the practice tee this morning to try to figure out what procedure to take to the course, there is a senior tournament this weekend that I am participating in. First I hit the best shot possible using my best hitters lagging procedure followed by start down waggle and then right arm thrust. Next I used the more complete loading technique I learned from Clampett's book on the next shot.
With the exception of the lag loading procedure used, I tried very hard to make the two swings identical.
I definitely hit some good shots with each method, but the data indicated a modest benefit from the more thorough lagging technique that I have been learning from Clampett's book. The increase lag creation, seemed to result for me in both a modest distance improvement (6 or 7 yards wedge) and also in a bit more distance and line consistency. Also I esthetically enjoy the superior feel of the more complete loading technique because I can feel the additional power I am bringing to the ball, in my #3 pressure point.
Btw Clampett talks about the low point of his swing (center of his divot) being 4 inches in front of the ball. So that is a substantial difference from what you are talking about. Maybe the different location of low point may have played a minor role and establishing a winner in my test? Thanks very very much for sharing your expertise with me. In particular, your tip about the right shoulder acting as a trigger for the right forearm thrust has improved my timing of when to let my right tricept do its thing.
Earlier in this thread you mentioned that "A Hitter needs to set his Flying Wedges and leave them be until Impact."
This morning I decided to focus on that idea. It appears that when my attention isn't concentrating on my Angled Hinge, it doesn't necessarily stay in proper alignment particularly as it gets close to the ball. Now, my shots are staying much more on line. Great suggestion Mike.
Btw Clampett talks about the low point of his swing (center of his divot) being 4 inches in front of the ball. So that is a substantial difference from what you are talking about. Maybe the different location of low point may have played a minor role and establishing a winner in my test? Thanks very very much for sharing your expertise with me. In particular, your tip about the right shoulder acting as a trigger for the right forearm thrust has improved my timing of when to let my right tricept do its thing.
I guess Clampett just places the ball further back in the stance. Either that, or he has several inches of slide forward. I didn't think it was very clear from reading the book.
"I guess Clampett just places the ball further back in the stance. Either that, or he has several inches of slide forward. I didn't think it was very clear from reading the book."
Took a look at the book today and if you look at the pictures carefully that accompany the text, you will see that his ball is indeed positioned properly forward. So I don't think he places the ball further back in the stance.
Bobby is famous for his skilled use of lag which is about delaying the release of the club head. Even if his lagging methods delays the club heads release by a few fractions of a second, because the club head is moving at such a high speed, the extra milliseconds may be what allows him to move his low point slightly forward from where others low point is. Also he strongly encourages golfers to aim so that their low point will occur further forward, and perhaps what you strive for, you have a better chance of achieving. I practice in the sand trap, moving the low point of my contact well past where the ball is. I am not achieving a low point that is fully 4 inches forward of the ball, but I am making some progress.
Hybrid Mode
